Why do people have children? All pain and no gain?

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well-informed
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Post by well-informed »

Lol sounds like your already dissapointed in your son, unless of course he becomes a rich famous baseball pitcher :)
globetrotter
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Post by globetrotter »

Winston wrote:I know why the human race needs children to continue the species. I am asking about the parents' reasons, not that of society, and how the parents justify the expenses and energy they put into it without tangible reward.
Does someone have to explain to you that there are rewards in life that are not tangible?
onezero4u
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Post by onezero4u »

imo when the global population was more agriculturally based and had a higher mortality rate....parents NEEDED to have more kids to help around the farm and actually be an asset instead of only a financial drain. since many babies-children died young, you had to hedge your bet and have more kids just in case.

besides passing on ones genes, i think an impulse to pass on ones wealth-property is also present.
marriage is a 3 ring circus: engagement ring, wedding ring and then suffering.
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Post by swincor »

well-informed wrote:Lol sounds like your already dissapointed in your son, unless of course he becomes a rich famous baseball pitcher :)
I think you got it.
Rock
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Post by Rock »

swincor__ wrote:
well-informed wrote:Lol sounds like your already dissapointed in your son, unless of course he becomes a rich famous baseball pitcher :)
I think you got it.
Didn't know Winston was into baseball.
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Winston
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Post by Winston »

Rock wrote:
swincor__ wrote:
well-informed wrote:Lol sounds like your already dissapointed in your son, unless of course he becomes a rich famous baseball pitcher :)
I think you got it.
Didn't know Winston was into baseball.
I'm not. They are insinuating that if my son became rich and famous, that I'd see a "tangible reward" in it. lol
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TRADER1972
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Post by TRADER1972 »

My son brings me joys no one else can.
I would rather make $2000 a month working for myself, then $4000 a month working for a bitch.
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Children - A Scam by Mother Nature? All Cost and No Benefit

Post by Winston »

Are children a scam by mother nature? It seems like it. I mean, look at the obvious. They provide no benefit to your life, yet incur enormous amounts of energy, time, cost and tax your mental sanity too. Look at the facts:

- They do not provide you with fun (a screaming toddler throwing tantrums every minute will ruin any vacation).
- They do not give you peace of mind (which is the most important thing). In fact, they destroy it and tax your nerves and sanity with stress.
- They do not give you any profit or revenue.
- They do not provide any intelligent stimulating conversation.

All they do is take from you, and alleviate that strange "emptiness" within you that mother nature instills in order to propagate the species. So aren't they a scam by mother nature then?

I know that might sound like a terrible thing to say since we are indoctrinated to believe that "children are sacred" but the facts are the facts. With children, you have to give a lot in exchange for little or nothing. And in the end, it may NOT be worth all the trouble, effort and time you put into it. Yet you still feel inclined by instinct to have them.

Basically, if you have a rich and fulfilling life without children, then there is really no reason to have them, for they would only hamper and hinder what you already have. They will not add anything to it, but cause a ton of trouble beyond your imagination instead. So is it really worth it?

It also depends on how giving you are. People who are naturally giving and nurturing and don't care about their own needs very much, or are the type that care about others more than themselves, will have an easier time being a parent. But if you are self-absorbed and make your goals and ambitions your priority, then becoming a parent would be a huge detriment to you.

So what do children provide? Well here are some "benefits" cited:

- The feeling of being loved back (why can't you get that from your lovers and friends? is love really worth that much trouble?)
- Having them take care of you in your old age (well maybe, unless you live in America of course, but then again, why sacrifice your best years just for that)
- Looking "normal" to others because you have a family (but then you are living for what others think)
- Passing on your genes so that you are not the "end of the line" (your ego's way of trying to extend its life I guess)

But is all that really worth 18 or more years of fruitless stress, all for no tangible benefit to yourself? Look at the costs involved:

- Enormous amounts of money with no reward or payback
- A huge sacrifice of your time in opportunity cost, which is priceless and you can't get back
- Enormous amounts of energy depleted in managing them
- Years of stress and conflict from them that ages your body and makes you feel old and tired
- Their constant narcissistic demand for attention and attitude that you owe them everything for bringing them into this world and that you are their servant

So basically, to have children, you've got to give up your own life! Is all that really worth it??? Well, not if you care about your own life it seems, unless your life is shit and empty and you have nothing to live for...

So is it worth it? I don't know. It doesn't seem like it.

What's scary is that once you become a parent, like I have, immediately mother nature begins to try to mind control you into forgetting about your life and focusing on your children's and making them the center of your world and purpose of your life, for obvious evolutionary reasons. So far, I've resisted this mind control by mother nature, but for how long who knows?

I know that if I keep thinking this way, my son may grow to resent me someday. But look at my choices. I either:

1) Give up the rest of my life and forget my needs and goals, and center my life on my child's needs and whims, and afterward just wait to die, just so that my son can say that I was "a good father".
2) Live my life to the fullest in accord with my dignity and heart, and to hell with the consequences.

Is there a middle ground? Society says that you should do #1, but when you look at it realistically, it's not so clear that that's a good choice (unless children are your passion of course). But anyhow, it's not realistic to expect people to just "give up everything" is it? Boy, the dilemma really sucks.

Check out this interesting site that one of my forum members found, by the way.

http://www.thechildfreelife.com
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Baron
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Well..

Post by Baron »

I have a different idea..

Perhaps, maybe it is because you have a naughty boy....

Being honest, I really didn't like kids even until i was age of 30.........
I hated kids crying and all that........

But guess what?

My kids are the most happiest encounter that happened to me in my whole life!

Perhaps, my baby girl and son might turn out to be bad kids when they grow up and all that..
but, for that time being, the value of having them is PRICELESS to me...

Plus, I am just trying to find my way of seperating and allocating my time and energy between work / wife / and kids...
It works ok for me so far...

Last thing to say is...

I can't imagine living without my sweet children... I guess it's all subjective..
If you see unusual things happening, tell yourself "Welcome to the Philippines!!" and you can finally understand the truth...
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Post by Winston »

Contrarian Expatriate wrote:Several reasons:

-Social pressure from family, friends and community. Every time a group claps when they hear of a birth or engagement, that is social pressure on all within earshot to get married/have kids.

-The "Keep Up With The Joneses" effect.

-Religious mandate or clergy encouragement, ie. "Be fruitful and multiply" from Christianity.

-To give their otherwise empty lives meaning. If your life has meaning, you don't need children.
The last reason seems true. Why do so many parents on TV say that they live for their kids and have nothing to live for without them? They say this when their kids are missing or kidnapped. I've never understood having nothing to live for except kids. Seems kind of sick and imbalanced to be totally living to nurture someone else. I don't think that's a healthy thing.

I also don't get those couples who say that they love the kids more than each other and are staying together just for the kids. Strange mentality. I can't imagine thinking that way.

I guess some people have a nurturing gene and some don't. That's why people who love kids usually also love pets. So besides our primary instincts for survival, food and sex, there must be a nurturing gene as well, but not everyone has it.

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