Are fathers supposed to no longer value their own lives?

[Rock]

So how come women and children are considered sacred but men aren't? What is the logic behind that? Why are men more expendable somehow? What is the basis of that?

Do we know that rule/value to apply to all cultures? Would Saudis/Indians/Polynesians/etc. automatically give women and/or children first priority access to limited life boat space?

I don't know. Maybe it's mostly an American/British thing. But then again, what is the basis and rationale behind it in America? Why is it that in America, men are not sacred but women and children are? Based on what logic?

Perhaps its connected in some way to Victorian Morality?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Women_and_ ... t_(saying)

[Winston]

Well I can understand the Victorian logic that since women and children are physically weaker, that they must be more protected and sheltered than men. However, what I don't get is why their lives are somehow more "sacred" or "precious" than men's. That doesn't make sense and sounds like pure bias.

[Rock]

Well I can understand the Victorian logic that since women and children are physically weaker, that they must be more protected and sheltered than men. However, what I don't get is why their lives are somehow more "sacred" or "precious" than men's. That doesn't make sense and sounds like pure bias.

You're not the only one:

"Some analysts such as Dr Carey Roberts and Dr David Benatar have viewed the policy of "women and children first" (and conscription) as evidence of what Warren Farrell refers to as "male disposability," where preservation of a woman's life is given priority over preservation of a man's life.[5][6] Further, this policy, particularly as applied to incidents like the sinking of the Titanic, resulted in high numbers of widows or orphans who might then face economic and social difficulty."

[swincor]

But I don't get why a father has to no longer value his own life when he has kids, just cause everyone says so? That's the part I don't get.

I agree that children are sacred and precious. That's fine. But why aren't the lives of fathers and men sacred and precious as well? Why are fathers expected to be self-sacrificing and view their own lives as worthless? Just cause society says so? Nothing else? That's not fair or good enough.

Winston Wu: "Nothing wrong with a guy who wants occasional freedom and fun."

Chemist: "Then you should have stayed single, and taken precautions to avoid impregnating somebody."

[TRADER1972]

I always remember that line, "You are like a son to me... and like a son, I can always have another."

Thats some funny shit.

[globetrotter]

I have a question I'm wondering about. How come most fathers on TV and in public say that they love their children so much that they wouldn't hesitate to give up their own life for them if they had to? Even Alex Jones said that in his Christmas speech. It's so common to say that that it's become a cliche.

Cliches are cliches because they are truisms that are repeated too frequently.

Cliches are not false - to the contrary, they are usually true.

This attitude that fathers have regarding their children has existed for most of the 19th and 20th Centuries in the USA and West.

It's nothing new.

[chileanueva]

We need women to carry our seed and raise our children. Kids will grow up dysfunctional without a stable home. Good and responsible parenting is crucial to properly raise decent kids. Children are innocent and vulnerable, parents need to protect and guide them from the dangers of the world.

Society places a heavy burden on men: work to death, don't complain, no emotion, and suck it up. Men are pressured by friends and family to find a wife and start a family. They are considered "weird" or "loser" if they don't accomplish those expectations.

I say f**k everyone else, do what you want to do. What are those other people doing for you? If the answer is nothing, then you can tell them to go f**k themselves.

You don't have to break your back and lose your sanity to marry a nagging wife and take care of spoiled brats. You deserve to be happy too.

[Billy]

+1 Konrad. lol.

Why does nobody discuss this with scientific arguments?

Maybe the woman in the north had to be stronger as their counterparts in the south. Because the conditions in the north were harder. That´s maybe the reason woman in the north are stronger and more emancipated. Because of that there value is higher.

For example in southern countries harems were quite normal. So the value of women was lower.

On the other had for the horny guys who saw them as sex objects the value could be higher.

[Winston]

A taboo question:

How come most parents, when they have children, some switch in them flips that makes them willing to sacrifice everything in life, including their own freedom, for their child, placing them above all else? What causes this? Is it something innate? Is there a switch programmed in people's genes that makes them suddenly become selfless and willing to put their child above everything, including themselves?

If so, how come I don't feel that way? Do I lack some sort of "switch" in my genes, or a "self-sacrificing gene" that switches on when people become parents? Or am I so selfish and narcissistic that it overrides this "switch or gene"?

To me, a child is like a relative. You care about your relatives in an abstract sense, like you are obligated to because they are your blood relatives. You may help them and do what you can for them. But you are not willing to give up everything for them, or put them above you, especially not your freedom.