What’s the truth about heaven and hell?

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Pinayhunter
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What’s the truth about heaven and hell?

Post by Pinayhunter »

http://www.isawthelightministries.com/hell.html

Summary:
- Everyone goes through soul sleep at death
- Those who had faith and were baptized are resurrected when Jesus returns and live with Him on Earth for 1000 years. These people are guaranteed eternal life. Satan is locked up during this time
- After the 1000 years pass, the rest of humanity is resurrected. They all have 100 years to accept Jesus as their Savior. Satan is again unleashed and allowed to deceive people. Most people will end up getting saved during this time.
- After the 100 years, those who still reject Jesus are consumed by fire along with Satan and his angels. They cease to exist.
- Everyone else lives in a kind of paradise on Earth, just like how it was before Adam and Eve ate the apple.

What do you think? I’d like this to be true, but I have my doubts. It’s the first time I’ve read about this version of heaven and hell. It also goes against all the heaven/hell testimonies on YouTube.


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Neo
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Re: What’s the truth about heaven and hell?

Post by Neo »

Baptism is a commandment. We are not saved by completing the commandments but by our faith in Christ. Keeping the commandments is to please God, but it doesn't save.
Prudence is the knowledge of things to be sought, and those to be shunned.
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Neo
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Re: What’s the truth about heaven and hell?

Post by Neo »

By the way, there is no literal soul sleep. When a person dies, they either go to hell or to heaven. There is no state of suspended animation or waiting period.

The bodies of the believers will be resurrected at the Second Coming of the Lord.

Soul sleep is one of those false doctrines, along with work salvation.

Pastor Steven L Anderson has done a whole series on the End Times prophecies and the Book of Revelation. You can find him on YT under Sanderson1611.
Prudence is the knowledge of things to be sought, and those to be shunned.
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Re: What’s the truth about heaven and hell?

Post by Pinayhunter »

Thanks for the recommendation. I’ll check it it out.

I’m still wrestling with this idea of hell. Knowing most people are going to be in excruciating pain for all eternity - their flesh melting off the bones, the feeling of suffocation, extreme thirst, starvation, complete isolation.

Knowing this place exists makes everything on Earth seem so trivial. How can I even go play tennis or something?
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Neo
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Re: What’s the truth about heaven and hell?

Post by Neo »

Pinayhunter wrote:
January 21st, 2019, 8:19 am
Thanks for the recommendation. I’ll check it it out.

I’m still wrestling with this idea of hell. Knowing most people are going to be in excruciating pain for all eternity - their flesh melting off the bones, the feeling of suffocation, extreme thirst, starvation, complete isolation.

Knowing this place exists makes everything on Earth seem so trivial. How can I even go play tennis or something?
People don't go to that place by accident. A person has to debase himself or herself to such a terrible degree so that God no longer wants them. The wages of sin is death. The repayment or earnings of sin is death. In other words, God wants everyone to go to heaven, and if a person hasn't destroyed himself, then it is likely he will eventually get saved.

Just remember, salvation is by faith alone; baptism is work. Trusting in works is not placing complete faith in Christ.
Prudence is the knowledge of things to be sought, and those to be shunned.
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Re: What’s the truth about heaven and hell?

Post by flowerthief00 »

The truth, if you're ready for it, is that these concepts are a drug invented by man to cope with the injustice of a life that is nasty, brutish, and short. If you're not ready for the truth, if the drug seems to be helping, I guess keep taking it. It was invented for that purpose.
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E Irizarry R&B Singer
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Re: What’s the truth about heaven and hell?

Post by E Irizarry R&B Singer »

Shit doesn't exist. It's a figment of one's imagination.
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Re: What’s the truth about heaven and hell?

Post by Preacher »

Pinayhunter wrote:
January 20th, 2019, 8:14 am

Summary:
- Everyone goes through soul sleep at death
- Those who had faith and were baptized are resurrected when Jesus returns and live with Him on Earth for 1000 years. These people are guaranteed eternal life. Satan is locked up during this time
- After the 1000 years pass, the rest of humanity is resurrected. They all have 100 years to accept Jesus as their Savior. Satan is again unleashed and allowed to deceive people. Most people will end up getting saved during this time.
- After the 100 years, those who still reject Jesus are consumed by fire along with Satan and his angels. They cease to exist.
- Everyone else lives in a kind of paradise on Earth, just like how it was before Adam and Eve ate the apple.

What do you think? I’d like this to be true, but I have my doubts. It’s the first time I’ve read about this version of heaven and hell. It also goes against all the heaven/hell testimonies on YouTube.
Heaven and Hell are both real places.
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Winston
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Re: What’s the truth about heaven and hell?

Post by Winston »

Preacher wrote:
October 12th, 2020, 3:03 am
Pinayhunter wrote:
January 20th, 2019, 8:14 am

Summary:
- Everyone goes through soul sleep at death
- Those who had faith and were baptized are resurrected when Jesus returns and live with Him on Earth for 1000 years. These people are guaranteed eternal life. Satan is locked up during this time
- After the 1000 years pass, the rest of humanity is resurrected. They all have 100 years to accept Jesus as their Savior. Satan is again unleashed and allowed to deceive people. Most people will end up getting saved during this time.
- After the 100 years, those who still reject Jesus are consumed by fire along with Satan and his angels. They cease to exist.
- Everyone else lives in a kind of paradise on Earth, just like how it was before Adam and Eve ate the apple.

What do you think? I’d like this to be true, but I have my doubts. It’s the first time I’ve read about this version of heaven and hell. It also goes against all the heaven/hell testimonies on YouTube.
Heaven and Hell are both real places.
How do you know that? Just because some text in a book says so doesn't make it true. Come on. The Bible was written by man. We all know that.

The greatest spiritual teachers such as Buddha and Jesus all said that heaven and hell are WITHIN us, they are a state of mind, not a place. Many spiritual books have said this too.

Some people who have NDE's see heaven or hell, but these could be temporary states. Some religious traditions teach that hell is a temporary place for tormented people who commit the sin of suicide. But it's temporary and the soul gets out of it eventually. What's the point of a God punshing you for all eternity? It makes no sense and is illogical and excessive and overkill.

Don't you think the doctrine of hell was invented as a way to scare people to make them comply with the control system of orthodox Christian Churches? That's what all wise people and intellectuals who are awake say. If the wisest people say that, there is probably something to it. Even the top non-religious Bible scholars say that.
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Re: What’s the truth about heaven and hell?

Post by Winston »

Neo wrote:
January 20th, 2019, 3:46 pm
By the way, there is no literal soul sleep. When a person dies, they either go to hell or to heaven. There is no state of suspended animation or waiting period.

The bodies of the believers will be resurrected at the Second Coming of the Lord.

Soul sleep is one of those false doctrines, along with work salvation.

Pastor Steven L Anderson has done a whole series on the End Times prophecies and the Book of Revelation. You can find him on YT under Sanderson1611.
That depends on which Bible verses you focus on. Different BIble verses say different things. You forget that the Bible is not one book, it's 66 books written by many different authors throughout different time periods. So it's not one book that says one thing. It's many books that say many DIFFERENT things.

Some verses also say that the non-believer's soul is simply extinguished at death with no afterlife in heaven or hell. The Jehovah's Witnesses for example, can you show you the original Greek or Hebrew version of the Bible that says that. They have lots of scholars that know Greek or Hebrew that could easily outwit you in a debate, since the average American cannot discuss original texts in Greek or Hebrew.

If you think about it, this makes more sense. Imagine you were running a SIMS game or RPG game, and you wanted to save a few characters for a new game, but not the rest. Would you save a few characters that you like and send the rest to a simulation or program of eternal everlasting torment? Or would you simply reset the game and allow the rest of the characters you don't need to go into oblivion? Just like you do when you shut down your computer at night? Obviously that would make more sense. No need to punish anyone eternally. No one is that sadistic. Not even Hitler.

Why are you so narrow and believe that there is only one right way, one truth, and one interpretation of the Bible? Come on. Are you serious or just acting. No one is that narrow and dogmatic. Smart people don't think like that.
People don't go to that place by accident. A person has to debase himself or herself to such a terrible degree so that God no longer wants them. The wages of sin is death. The repayment or earnings of sin is death. In other words, God wants everyone to go to heaven, and if a person hasn't destroyed himself, then it is likely he will eventually get saved.

Just remember, salvation is by faith alone; baptism is work. Trusting in works is not placing complete faith in Christ.
Not according to Evangelical Fundamentalist Christianity. In their doctrine, even a good person will go to hell, if he or she dies without accepting Christ. Because no one is good, as Paul says in Romans, we are all born with original sin, and so even a good person is imperfect and going to hell unless they accept Christ. That's basic standard Evangelical doctrine. I'm sure you know that. You don't have to debase yourself. You can be a generally good moral person and go to hell, under this doctrine too. Simply because you were born imperfect, which is not our fault of course, hence this doctrine is 1000 percent UNJUST. That's what repels a lot of people to turn away from Christianity, because this doctrine is sheer nonsense and 1000 percent UNJUST.
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Re: What’s the truth about heaven and hell?

Post by Winston »

Pinayhunter wrote:
January 21st, 2019, 8:19 am
Thanks for the recommendation. I’ll check it it out.

I’m still wrestling with this idea of hell. Knowing most people are going to be in excruciating pain for all eternity - their flesh melting off the bones, the feeling of suffocation, extreme thirst, starvation, complete isolation.

Knowing this place exists makes everything on Earth seem so trivial. How can I even go play tennis or something?
When I was a fundamentalist Christian, I would wrestle with that too. It's very disturbing and hard to believe literally.

However, the great Truther/Conspiracy expert Jordan Maxwell often brings this up in his interviews and lectures.

He says that when he was in Catholic school as a boy, he asked a teacher this question: "If I used a welding fire torch, could I burn an angel if it passed by?" The teacher replied "Of course not." Jordan asked "Why not?" The teacher replied "Because angels are spirit and spirit cannot be burned by fire torches. Only physical objects can be burned that way." Then Jordan replied "Then why should I be worried about going to hell? How can the fires in hell burn my soul if I am in spirit form?" The teacher got angry and told him to "Shut up!"

The interviewer and audience always laugh when he tells that story. It illustrates how ridiculous religious doctrine can be.
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Neo
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Re: What’s the truth about heaven and hell?

Post by Neo »

Winston wrote:
October 12th, 2020, 6:18 pm
Neo wrote:
January 20th, 2019, 3:46 pm
By the way, there is no literal soul sleep. When a person dies, they either go to hell or to heaven. There is no state of suspended animation or waiting period.

The bodies of the believers will be resurrected at the Second Coming of the Lord.

Soul sleep is one of those false doctrines, along with work salvation.

Pastor Steven L Anderson has done a whole series on the End Times prophecies and the Book of Revelation. You can find him on YT under Sanderson1611.
That depends on which Bible verses you focus on. Different BIble verses say different things. You forget that the Bible is not one book, it's 66 books written by many different authors throughout different time periods. So it's not one book that says one thing. It's many books that say many DIFFERENT things.

Some verses also say that the non-believer's soul is simply extinguished at death with no afterlife in heaven or hell. The Jehovah's Witnesses for example, can you show you the original Greek or Hebrew version of the Bible that says that. They have lots of scholars that know Greek or Hebrew that could easily outwit you in a debate, since the average American cannot discuss original texts in Greek or Hebrew.

If you think about it, this makes more sense. Imagine you were running a SIMS game or RPG game, and you wanted to save a few characters for a new game, but not the rest. Would you save a few characters that you like and send the rest to a simulation or program of eternal everlasting torment? Or would you simply reset the game and allow the rest of the characters you don't need to go into oblivion? Just like you do when you shut down your computer at night? Obviously that would make more sense. No need to punish anyone eternally. No one is that sadistic. Not even Hitler.

Why are you so narrow and believe that there is only one right way, one truth, and one interpretation of the Bible? Come on. Are you serious or just acting. No one is that narrow and dogmatic. Smart people don't think like that.
People don't go to that place by accident. A person has to debase himself or herself to such a terrible degree so that God no longer wants them. The wages of sin is death. The repayment or earnings of sin is death. In other words, God wants everyone to go to heaven, and if a person hasn't destroyed himself, then it is likely he will eventually get saved.

Just remember, salvation is by faith alone; baptism is work. Trusting in works is not placing complete faith in Christ.
Not according to Evangelical Fundamentalist Christianity. In their doctrine, even a good person will go to hell, if he or she dies without accepting Christ. Because no one is good, as Paul says in Romans, we are all born with original sin, and so even a good person is imperfect and going to hell unless they accept Christ. That's basic standard Evangelical doctrine. I'm sure you know that. You don't have to debase yourself. You can be a generally good moral person and go to hell, under this doctrine too. Simply because you were born imperfect, which is not our fault of course, hence this doctrine is 1000 percent UNJUST. That's what repels a lot of people to turn away from Christianity, because this doctrine is sheer nonsense and 1000 percent UNJUST.
Jehovah's Witness doctrine is mostly nonsense. It's hard to even accept that people could believe it, because it is absurd the things that are taught in that false version of Christianity. Anyone interested can look it up, because I'm simply not interested in writing it out at the present moment. And their Bible version is twisted in a way to support their false teachings.

JW is another false Christianity that was started up to lead people away from Christ into heresy. It's plainly obvious to most people. It has similar roots to Mormonism, with secret societies and Freemasonry. Also similar to Seventh Day Adventism.

As for original sin, I don't know much about that. That sounds more like a Catholic doctrine than a Christian doctrine.

As far as sin, a person needs to not make himself vile or an abomination, so that God doesn't give that person over to a reprobate mind that cannot be saved. In other words, salvation is not by trusting in a person's own works of righteousness, but a person can condemn himself by abounding in wickedness to the point where God is literally disgusted with and is no longer interested in the person. Salvation is by faith but not everyone will be able to believe. Many will have their minds and eyes blinded to salvation and will not find it, because they went too far with wickedness.

As far as Adam and Eve, that just means that before "The Fall" people were incapable of sin. Now after "The Fall" people are able to sin because people are able to do evil. That's all that means.

Many people believe that a good or decent person who isn't corrupt with die unsaved and go to hell, for some reason. The good or decent person who is not corrupt will eventually get saved. God will not let the least grain fall upon the earth when He sifts the grain.

So as long as a person hasn't made himself or herself an abomination in the eyes of God, He may save him or her (read Psalms 14 and 53). He wants to save every soul. He doesn't want anyone to perish. But some are so wicked that He is disgusted with the evil they do. God hates the corrupt workers. So a person must avoid corruption so that God will eventually rain down salvation upon him. Corrupt people cannot believe, because their minds are rejected.

As for comparing life to a computer game, keep in mind that God's ways are higher than our ways. A person may think just erasing the board and starting over again is fair. However, according to the Bible, evildoers will be punished, and those who've gone too far will be punished with everlasting torment for their evil deeds.

As for the Bible having many different authors, for some reason some people can't believe in the power of God and the Holy Ghost. The authors penned the Bible, but by the inspiration of the Holy Ghost, who is God.
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Re: What’s the truth about heaven and hell?

Post by Neo »

Winston wrote:
October 12th, 2020, 6:04 pm
Preacher wrote:
October 12th, 2020, 3:03 am
Pinayhunter wrote:
January 20th, 2019, 8:14 am

Summary:
- Everyone goes through soul sleep at death
- Those who had faith and were baptized are resurrected when Jesus returns and live with Him on Earth for 1000 years. These people are guaranteed eternal life. Satan is locked up during this time
- After the 1000 years pass, the rest of humanity is resurrected. They all have 100 years to accept Jesus as their Savior. Satan is again unleashed and allowed to deceive people. Most people will end up getting saved during this time.
- After the 100 years, those who still reject Jesus are consumed by fire along with Satan and his angels. They cease to exist.
- Everyone else lives in a kind of paradise on Earth, just like how it was before Adam and Eve ate the apple.

What do you think? I’d like this to be true, but I have my doubts. It’s the first time I’ve read about this version of heaven and hell. It also goes against all the heaven/hell testimonies on YouTube.
Heaven and Hell are both real places.
How do you know that? Just because some text in a book says so doesn't make it true. Come on. The Bible was written by man. We all know that.

The greatest spiritual teachers such as Buddha and Jesus all said that heaven and hell are WITHIN us, they are a state of mind, not a place. Many spiritual books have said this too.

Some people who have NDE's see heaven or hell, but these could be temporary states. Some religious traditions teach that hell is a temporary place for tormented people who commit the sin of suicide. But it's temporary and the soul gets out of it eventually. What's the point of a God punshing you for all eternity? It makes no sense and is illogical and excessive and overkill.

Don't you think the doctrine of hell was invented as a way to scare people to make them comply with the control system of orthodox Christian Churches? That's what all wise people and intellectuals who are awake say. If the wisest people say that, there is probably something to it. Even the top non-religious Bible scholars say that.
Hell is real. It is the recompense to evildoers for their evil deeds.
Prudence is the knowledge of things to be sought, and those to be shunned.
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Re: What’s the truth about heaven and hell?

Post by Preacher »

Winston wrote:
October 12th, 2020, 6:04 pm
Preacher wrote:
October 12th, 2020, 3:03 am
Pinayhunter wrote:
January 20th, 2019, 8:14 am

Summary:
- Everyone goes through soul sleep at death
- Those who had faith and were baptized are resurrected when Jesus returns and live with Him on Earth for 1000 years. These people are guaranteed eternal life. Satan is locked up during this time
- After the 1000 years pass, the rest of humanity is resurrected. They all have 100 years to accept Jesus as their Savior. Satan is again unleashed and allowed to deceive people. Most people will end up getting saved during this time.
- After the 100 years, those who still reject Jesus are consumed by fire along with Satan and his angels. They cease to exist.
- Everyone else lives in a kind of paradise on Earth, just like how it was before Adam and Eve ate the apple.

What do you think? I’d like this to be true, but I have my doubts. It’s the first time I’ve read about this version of heaven and hell. It also goes against all the heaven/hell testimonies on YouTube.
Heaven and Hell are both real places.
How do you know that? Just because some text in a book says so doesn't make it true. Come on. The Bible was written by man. We all know that.

The greatest spiritual teachers such as Buddha and Jesus all said that heaven and hell are WITHIN us, they are a state of mind, not a place. Many spiritual books have said this too.

Some people who have NDE's see heaven or hell, but these could be temporary states. Some religious traditions teach that hell is a temporary place for tormented people who commit the sin of suicide. But it's temporary and the soul gets out of it eventually. What's the point of a God punshing you for all eternity? It makes no sense and is illogical and excessive and overkill.

Don't you think the doctrine of hell was invented as a way to scare people to make them comply with the control system of orthodox Christian Churches? That's what all wise people and intellectuals who are awake say. If the wisest people say that, there is probably something to it. Even the top non-religious Bible scholars say that.
The Bible makes it clear, plus there are people who had what is known as a Near Death Experience and saw Heaven and also Hell.
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Re: What’s the truth about heaven and hell?

Post by Neo »

Winston wrote:
October 12th, 2020, 6:27 pm
Pinayhunter wrote:
January 21st, 2019, 8:19 am
Thanks for the recommendation. I’ll check it it out.

I’m still wrestling with this idea of hell. Knowing most people are going to be in excruciating pain for all eternity - their flesh melting off the bones, the feeling of suffocation, extreme thirst, starvation, complete isolation.

Knowing this place exists makes everything on Earth seem so trivial. How can I even go play tennis or something?
When I was a fundamentalist Christian, I would wrestle with that too. It's very disturbing and hard to believe literally.

However, the great Truther/Conspiracy expert Jordan Maxwell often brings this up in his interviews and lectures.

He says that when he was in Catholic school as a boy, he asked a teacher this question: "If I used a welding fire torch, could I burn an angel if it passed by?" The teacher replied "Of course not." Jordan asked "Why not?" The teacher replied "Because angels are spirit and spirit cannot be burned by fire torches. Only physical objects can be burned that way." Then Jordan replied "Then why should I be worried about going to hell? How can the fires in hell burn my soul if I am in spirit form?" The teacher got angry and told him to "Shut up!"

The interviewer and audience always laugh when he tells that story. It illustrates how ridiculous religious doctrine can be.

Naturally a person can believe whatever he or she wants to. However, it should be clear, that the power of fire in hell is not the same as the power of fire on the earth. The fires of hell were specifically made for torment and punishment. The fire on earth was not made for that purpose. See Matthew 25:41 KJV . That verse also directly answers the story you've cited in your above quote.
Prudence is the knowledge of things to be sought, and those to be shunned.
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