Happier Abroad Forum Community

This is mostly in response to Ladislav, who suggested I start a thread on my specific plan to move abroad. Any insights from others would appreciated, of course.

Right off the bat, I'm thinking of getting citizenship through my Italian heritage. I figure at that point, I'd live in the EU for a while. I figure I'd either stay there or move to Eastern Europe. Spain & the Czech Republic are two places that really caught my interest, but Portugal is in the top three & Italy might be a good idea since I am Italian (although, it might be harder to do now- economy & immigration that sounds like it's turning into a subtle invasion).

Work is more or less the same idea wherever I land: maybe start with manual labor (landscaping, working on a fishing boat, being a mover, etc...), then maybe get into tourism (it seems you need certification to actually teach languages at a school, but not to translate on tours & such), then do something like Dave Canterbury with teaching wilderness skills/self-reliance/disaster preparedness.

Manual labor is something I don't have any real problem with, considering that I like working outside & getting exertion in the right conditions. I figure they might be more likely to hire an Italian (especially in Italy) over someone that puts their head to the floor five times a day. I really think the guy that's a refugee one minute & a dictator the next is getting unwelcome over there. I think I'd support one over the other on a welfare level, too. At least if I hit hard times, I'd try to get myself set up again- instead of being proud of being a parasite.

With tourism, it seems that that business tends to do well even if the rest of the country isn't- since people come from other countries on vacation (particularly Spain, from what I hear).

In the Czech Republic, I might have all kinds of jobs open to me where normally they wouldn't be- since I speak English & that langauge ability would be something valued. It seems that they'd be willing to train someone with that going on, instead of just looking for someone with experience.

The Czech Republic seems to have a good "wilderness scene," organic food isn't hard to come by (apparently, you can get raw milk from vending machines- instead of getting locked-up for it, like in America), and seems to be less ball-breaking about laws in some ways (at the very least, there are no knife laws outside of not wantonly stabbing people). I really like how it's got enough of that "grey area" where you can get some things done under the table, without it being really dangerous like some places. They're a very open & honest people, from what I hear & from what I've seen (on occassion, as I haven't run into very many Czechs over here). That's important to me, as I'm someone that tends to need some explaining & I'll probably need to get into why I left America, anyway. Another things is that, if you can't just spit things out, you get all kinds of...well, communication problems. Communication is frequently intergral to problem-solving & there's an issue when trying to form relationships when communication is all ricochets & lying.

If I live in the Czech Republic for a while, I figure that could be like my half-way house ("Well, I was born in America but I've been living in the Czech Republic for the last __ years"). That way, I'm not just going over there as a flat-out American- with all the reputation that that would likely bring. I know it's not necessarily an issue if you're from America, but I can definitely see where someone would keep their distance from one at this point (I'm looking to get some distance from that culture, myself). So worried that everything I saw will be seen as a lie!

Spain seems to be similar in that way. I like that it's a bit more informal than Portugal & Italy seem to be, but it seems that you have to know people to get things going smoothly- a problem for someone just showing up that doesn't have family over there. Also, it seems that the economy is still kind of a tough situation- maybe it'd be better if I got set up financially somewhere else & bought a place to winter in after that. As far as laws go, I don't know what to think. On one hand, there's that Gag Law that the government put through that was more or less criminalizing any behavior in public. On the other hand, there were the people that set up a HOLOGRAPHIC PROTEST. I'd never even HEARD of something like that before. They were using holograms to make the point that these holograms now have greater rights than the actual people. The law seems to have taken effect on July 1, which was only a few days ago- so it's hard to know what will come of all this.

Portugal seems pretty cool as far as laws & society goes, but they also seem to be somewhat more formal & reserved. Again, an issue if you're just starting out & trying to get set up in a tough economy. I think I could get the knack of the language pretty quickly & the schools are supposed to be pretty good (some kids actually start to learn Chinese in public school & they don't seem to get attacked by cops for nonsense like splasing in puddles at five years old). I think the women would probably be pretty interesting & I think I have somewhat more of a tendency toward Latin women- although I haven't run into enough Slavic ones to really know if I'd click with them.

I would be more likely to go for a place that's not "America-esque" & one that doesn't have a heavy involvement with them. It seems Spain is getting more American troops, supposedly to be able to react to terrorism or border issues quickly- that seems like a good idea from a bad direction. I (as well as others) have noticed that when America gets involved, things tend to turn to shit pretty quickly. Even if the guys on the ground might see the flaw in a course of action, the leadership moves foward with it- seemingly BECAUSE it causes problems to get worse in spite of saying it will do the opposite. I think America is pulling a lot of strings in Europe, but also that Europe is getting sick & f***ing tired of it- so I don't know what to figure I'll be dealing with.

Well, that more or less sums it up. As far as women go, I've explained in other posts what I'm looking for- but the short version is that Latinas seem to be much more my taste & Slavics are suprisingly similar in a lot of those ways. As far as men go (co-existing, what kind of people you're working with, people you might be shoulder-to-shoulder with if something serious happens, etc...), I think I usually get along with Slavics a bit better. I like that there's a possible connection with Russia, too. If anything serious were to happen (like over Ukraine or whatever), I think I'd prefer being more on that side of things. I know not everything in America goes badly, but I can definitely see them flipping out on the people IN America in syncronization with whatever wars they have going on over there. It's happened before & as it stands now, even the rest of the world is looking at America in a "WTF?" way on that level. It's true medically, as well- come to think of it. Plenty of opportunity for those two things to mingle together & to be declared a non-issue, on top of it (which facilitates further instances of the same or similar things, of course).

As a general rule, Slavics tend to know that "what if?" stuff can happen & seem to think well of people that realize these things without all kinds of bullshit denial reactions- a man that can "look the devil in the eye," so to speak. I really like that it can just be a matter-of-fact kind of way, instead of it having to be an "extra" or an "extreme." I was always fairly misunderstood on that level & the simple fact that I'm not like a wind-up toy with conflict was always hard for people to get here. Slavics tend to understand being situational with that sort of thing & that you wouldn't just act one way all the time- Americans really seem to have it lodged in the back of their heads that you have to either be vicious all-around or hospitable all-around.

Hello Wolf,

For starters you seem to be all over the map with what you actually want to do and live. This isn't a bad thing but prior to actually carrying out your mission you should to as much research as possible and make sure you have
enough funds set aside. Nice thing is most Europe countries give you 90 days without any visa issues where as most Asian minus Hong Kong only 30 days unless you make arrangements prior to travel. Anyway back to Europe
look to stay in hostels and get to know your surroundings and travel by bus over train to safe money as well. I'm not so sure you would be able to find labor jobs as locals can easily fit the bill. In fact most countries only
look for expats to fill jobs that the locals can not fill. Everyone I've come across usually works overseas teaching English or works for some tech company from abroad but relocates to the companies overseas branch.

Also biggest thing you have to figure out if you like the culture, weather, language issues and over all way of life. I can tell you Asia is crowded (large cities), loud and very hot. You also have to adjust/integrate to how
ppl handle themselves and learn to play the game to fit in to your new culture.

God Speed and best of Luck!

Find a rich, elderly woman and marry her.

.

Sounds like a plan but do prepare to tweak it as you run into changing circumstances. You would need some savings to tide you over, of course- so hope you have those.

The only thing that bothers me in that plan is that you will be going to countries where women are not easy. Spain, Italy, the Czech Rep., Portugal. All those places have lots of horny men, and the women can be arrogant and not that pretty.

Also, on the language side of things- the countries you had mentioned are not English speaking and may not be willing much to accommodate an English only speaker- unlike the Philippines or even Japan where NOT learning the language can be to your advantage.

Really? I'd think the women from those places would generally be good-looking! I know I tend toward latinas & mediterraneans as far as looks go (usually blonde hair only works for me when it's her natural hair color, but then it's not everything). I guess the men would be something to compete with, but I figure my personality might be well-liked by women from there.

I DO plan to also speak those languages. I wouldn't really feel comfortable if I didn't & I couldn't very well translate anything if I didn't know both. Currently, I'm trying to learn Russian. I want to be able to speak a few languages & I seem to have an aptitude for it, but it's suprisingly hard to find things over here that really explain...well, anything. An example would be a language book not putting in what things would sound like if things were spelled the way they sound in English (ex: saying things like: "it sounds like the "a" in "father").

I always had a problem with books not explaining the concepts or getting into more advanced detail. Ever notice how almost every book is a "beginner's" book or an "introduction" to something? Dammit, why aren't there things that do more than make a reference or give an overview? That's one of the things that aggravate me about life over here- informational barrenness. Everyone is so starved of information that they think anyone that says something complicated is an expert!

Wolfeye. Latinas are not the same as " Latins". In L. America, Latinas are usually Indian black mix and there are many of them. In Europe, Italians, Spaniards and Portuguese are not Latinas. There are fewer of them and plenty of good guys around. But again, with the Internet now, things may be different. You only need one girl. don't you?

Me thinks you need to concentrate on one thing at a time and take it one step at a time. Going in so many directions at the same time and planning that far ahead complicates things. So is learning many languages at once.

And why Russian? It's not spoken in the places where you are going to. Ukraine is the only country where you can have the freedom to use it well. Russia, KZ and Belarus are all dictatorships which have restrictive visa policies and you can be banned for dating too many women in the latter two. Russian visas are a nightmare.

The best way to learn a language is by buying a good grammar book and then some 5 phrase books. You can also take lessons on language exchange clubs for free and get specific answers on answers.yahoo.com.

So, start with country 1 and work on it. Don't get ahead of yourself too much.

ladislav wrote:Russia, KZ and Belarus are all dictatorships which have restrictive visa policies and you can be banned for dating too many women in the latter two. Russian visas are a nightmare.

Someone can be banned for dating too many Belarussians or Kazakhstani women? Do you have news story link for this?

I am an American and currently have a Russian visa, and it was rather simple to get through a travel agent. Outside of a big city, getting it registered could be a bit of a problem if one doesn't know Russian (in St. Pete, where i am at, it's been easy to do.) And the visa is good for 6 months at a time, with a simple visa run out the country to restart the time (no 90/180 rule like the visa-free places), which is a simple bus ride from St. Pete to Estonia or Finland.