How come Greek/Mediterranean people are so soulful, passionate, vivacious, playful in ways Americans NEVER are?

[Winston]

Yesterday me and @kangarunner were talking on the phone and I brought up something interesting. Every time you meet someone from Greece or the Mediterranean, they seem so authentic, warm, and soulful in a way that's hard to describe, but which you can sense is TOTALLY LACKING in Americans. It's hard to put into words, do you know what I mean? It's like they have this something that Americans totally lack, which is super obvious, so I wonder why no one talks about it. It makes you wonder what amazing camaraderie the Greeks and Mediterranean people must have with their families and relatives. When they get together at family gatherings, they must party wild and hard, I always imagine.

You can see this in movies and TV shows too. Once example is the old movie "Zorba the Greek" in black and white. Americans never act that soulful or passionate in their voice and mannerisms. Do you guys know what I mean? You can also watch any TV broadcast from Latin America to know what I mean too, the authenticity is off the charts and something you never see in America.

Are Italians like that too? Or only Greeks and those from Malta? What do you think @publicduende? Are Italians and Spanish like this too?

The thing is, Greeks don't always claim their country is warm and happy. Some do, some don't. But from an American perspective, you would think their families and people must be very warm and happy and wild and festive.

Here's a short film called Katarin from 1977 made in Malta. You can see how expressive and uninhibited the people are in their expressions, and how natural and unspoiled the teenage girl is in this film. It's like some romantic long lost world that America never had.

[Lucas88]

@Winston

I've spent a lot of time in Spain. I've also enjoyed significant stints in Latin America. Most of my friends outside of @Pixel--Dude are either Spanish or Latin American. Latin/Mediterranean culture is my passion!

Mediterraneans are indeed much warmer and more soulful than Anglos. In Spain there is a kind of free-spiritedness and vivaciousness that just doesn't exist in Anglo countries and most people are friendly and welcoming and give much importance to social life. If you speak Spanish, it is so easy to make friends there. The culture is inclusive and allows for a wide range of self-expression. Formality is rare, most people prefer honesty over pretense or fake politeness, and you can just be yourself. Spain is one of the best places I've been to for social life but I would like to stress once again that you need to have a good level of Spanish in order to reap all of the benefits.

Spanish culture couldn't be any further from the cold and soulless culture of the UK. Spain is way better for making friends and dating by orders of magnitude. Take the following anecdote of mine to illustrate this point. In the UK I was a respected member of a MMA gym in my hometown since its inception but we didn't go out together for our first team meal until after 2 years of training together whereas in Spain I joined a wrestling club and was already invited out by the guys within just a few weeks after becoming a member. In my part of the UK most people keep to themselves even at activity clubs and such but in Spain on the other hand people proactively seek out friendships with you and invite you to social events.

Mediterraneans are much warmer and more soulful for various reasons.

First - and perhaps the most obvious reason-, the climate is actually warm and pleasant throughout the Mediterranean basin and this motivates people to go out more and be more sociable.

Second, Mediterranean people tend to have a more holistic conception of life which balances work/study and enjoyment. They don't view life only in terms of work and consumption as most Anglos do. Mediterraneans actually value time with friends and family as well as revelry and enjoyable experiences. Their culture was never exposed to the soulless Protestant Work Ethic as Northern Europe and the Anglo countries were.

Third, Mediterranean culture lacks the moralistic tendencies of Northern Europe and the Anglo countries due to its different historical developments. Northern Europe and the Anglo countries received a lot of influence from Protestantism since the Reformation. That particular strain of religion often has strong puritanical elements and encourages strict conformity. That, in my opinion, is the reason why Anglos, even the secular ones, tend to be so conformist and judgmental and why they are so anal about everything and feel the need to stick their nose into everybody else's lives. Latin countries on the other hand have always been historically Catholic. Catholicism usually isn't a strict form of religion. Latin people are mostly Pagans with a thin Catholic veneer, hence their greater free-spiritedness.

Fourth, Mediterraneans actually have a real civilization to enjoy with its beautiful architecture and soulful cities and all kinds of amazing cultural traditions and so their energetic frequency is being constantly uplifted by their positive environment. Anglos on the other hand mostly live in soulless depressing cities which lack authentic beauty and exist only for commerce. The patent ugliness of most Anglo cities lowers the vibrations of the people who inhabit them and causes people to become more negative and antisocial.

Fifth, Mediterranean languages such as Spanish, Italian and Greek all have very euphonious phonological inventories and therefore produce high vibrational frequencies when spoken. This serves to create a more positive and joyous mood in those who speak and hear those beautiful languages. Germanic languages on the other hand are much harsher and produce lower vibrational frequencies. They therefore push people more towards angst and negativity (just look at countries like the UK, Germany and Sweden).

I absolutely adore Mediterranean culture. I regard Mediterranean people as ethnically, culturally and linguistically superior to Anglos and other Northern Europeans and consider myself an honorary Mediterranean. Mediterranean civilization is the jewel of Europe. I'm proud to be a part of it through my integration into Spanish culture and my L2 Hispanophone status. I want nothing more than to rid myself of my unwanted Anglo identity.

[publicduende]

Yesterday me and @kangarunner were talking on the phone and I brought up something interesting. Every time you meet someone from Greece or the Mediterranean, they seem so authentic, warm, and soulful in a way that's hard to describe, but which you can sense is TOTALLY LACKING in Americans. It's hard to put into words, do you know what I mean? It's like they have this something that Americans totally lack, which is super obvious, so I wonder why no one talks about it. It makes you wonder what amazing camaraderie the Greeks and Mediterranean people must have with their families and relatives. When they get together at family gatherings, they must party wild and hard, I always imagine.

You can see this in movies and TV shows too. Once example is the old movie "Zorba the Greek" in black and white. Americans never act that soulful or passionate in their voice and mannerisms. Do you guys know what I mean? You can also watch any TV broadcast from Latin America to know what I mean too, the authenticity is off the charts and something you never see in America.

Are Italians like that too? Or only Greeks and those from Malta? What do you think @publicduende? Are Italians and Spanish like this too?

The thing is, Greeks don't always claim their country is warm and happy. Some do, some don't. But from an American perspective, you would think their families and people must be very warm and happy and wild and festive.

Here's a short film called Katarin from 1977 made in Malta. You can see how expressive and uninhibited the people are in their expressions, and how natural and unspoiled the teenage girl is in this film. It's like some romantic long lost world that America never had.

@Winston

I think you posted this video before and I already gave you an answer. It was from one of the many movies produced in the late 70s and early 80s, all around Europe, which were offering the image of a "teenage " female character, with a fully developed and fully desirable body, yet with an innocent/naive mannerism that ends up making her even more sensual, or erotic.

Bar a few notable exceptions, they were all B-movies, low-budget flicks featuring young, relatively unknown actresses chosen more for their fresh looks (they are all interpreting underage girls, after all) and sensual bodies, than for their acting skills.

I was too young to remember. From what I read, it was a movie genre that was quite popular precisely in the more traditional, Catholic countries: Italy, Spain and Portugal, Greece. Malta was practically created as a military outpost against the Ottomans and, even today, is probably the most traditional Catholic country in Europe. Sort of what Southern Italy was 60-70 years ago. Of course that doesn't mean that their typical men won't be titillated by those borderline Lolita storylines.

In Italy, our to-go person for Lolita-style characters was Gloria Guida.



As I learned, the Philippines had a similar string of titillating movies featuring actresses meant to be sold as "forbidden fruit". A famous one was Pepsi Paloma.



Back to your assumption that those movies are somewhat representing the European society of the time, or even of today...you can't be more wrong! Those movies were little outlets to titillate the overly-constrained adult male mind of the time. They were also little money-making machines.

What I would concede to your argument is, though, that at least the society of the time didn't outright ban them, since those topics were considered controversial, yet within the perimeter of what a male adult was supposed, or allowed, to fantasise about.

Compare and contrast with the unbelievable hypocrisy and double standards of today's woke world, where it is OK for pre-pubescent girls or boys to be force-fed LGBTQ+ bullcrap and even make their own choices about gender reassignment surgery, yet it's a crime for the average adult man to even hint at the fact that they might have some agency about their budding sexuality.

Or better still, hinting at children as sexual objects is OK if it's a member of the LGBTQ+ community who does it, a punishable offense otherwise.

[publicduende]

@Winston

I've spent a lot of time in Spain. I've also enjoyed significant stints in Latin America. Most of my friends outside of @Pixel--Dude are either Spanish or Latin American. Latin/Mediterranean culture is my passion!

Mediterraneans are indeed much warmer and more soulful than Anglos. In Spain there is a kind of free-spiritedness and vivaciousness that just doesn't exist in Anglo countries and most people are friendly and welcoming and give much importance to social life. If you speak Spanish, it is so easy to make friends there. The culture is inclusive and allows for a wide range of self-expression. Formality is rare, most people prefer honesty over pretense or fake politeness, and you can just be yourself. Spain is one of the best places I've been to for social life but I would like to stress once again that you need to have a good level of Spanish in order to reap all of the benefits.

Spanish culture couldn't be any further from the cold and soulless culture of the UK. Spain is way better for making friends and dating by orders of magnitude. Take the following anecdote of mine to illustrate this point. In the UK I was a respected member of a MMA gym in my hometown since its inception but we didn't go out together for our first team meal until after 2 years of training together whereas in Spain I joined a wrestling club and was already invited out by the guys within just a few weeks after becoming a member. In my part of the UK most people keep to themselves even at activity clubs and such but in Spain on the other hand people proactively seek out friendships with you and invite you to social events.

Mediterraneans are much warmer and more soulful for various reasons.

First - and perhaps the most obvious reason-, the climate is actually warm and pleasant throughout the Mediterranean basin and this motivates people to go out more and be more sociable.

Second, Mediterranean people tend to have a more holistic conception of life which balances work/study and enjoyment. They don't view life only in terms of work and consumption as most Anglos do. Mediterraneans actually value time with friends and family as well as revelry and enjoyable experiences. Their culture was never exposed to the soulless Protestant Work Ethic as Northern Europe and the Anglo countries were.

Third, Mediterranean culture lacks the moralistic tendencies of Northern Europe and the Anglo countries due to its different historical developments. Northern Europe and the Anglo countries received a lot of influence from Protestantism since the Reformation. That particular strain of religion often has strong puritanical elements and encourages strict conformity. That, in my opinion, is the reason why Anglos, even the secular ones, tend to be so conformist and judgmental and why they are so anal about everything and feel the need to stick their nose into everybody else's lives. Latin countries on the other hand have always been historically Catholic. Catholicism usually isn't a strict form of religion. Latin people are mostly Pagans with a thin Catholic veneer, hence their greater free-spiritedness.

Fourth, Mediterraneans actually have a real civilization to enjoy with its beautiful architecture and soulful cities and all kinds of amazing cultural traditions and so their energetic frequency is being constantly uplifted by their positive environment. Anglos on the other hand mostly live in soulless depressing cities which lack authentic beauty and exist only for commerce. The patent ugliness of most Anglo cities lowers the vibrations of the people who inhabit them and causes people to become more negative and antisocial.

Fifth, Mediterranean languages such as Spanish, Italian and Greek all have very euphonious phonological inventories and therefore produce high vibrational frequencies when spoken. This serves to create a more positive and joyous mood in those who speak and hear those beautiful languages. Germanic languages on the other hand are much harsher and produce lower vibrational frequencies. They therefore push people more towards angst and negativity (just look at countries like the UK, Germany and Sweden).

I absolutely adore Mediterranean culture. I regard Mediterranean people as ethnically, culturally and linguistically superior to Anglos and other Northern Europeans and consider myself an honorary Mediterranean. Mediterranean civilization is the jewel of Europe. I'm proud to be a part of it through my integration into Spanish culture and my L2 Hispanophone status. I want nothing more than to rid myself of my unwanted Anglo identity.

I am myself Italian, born and bred in the South of Italy, and may well agree with you, that Southern Europeans (Italians, Spaniards, Portuguese, Greeks, Maltese, etc.) tend to be more soulful, playful and vivacious. There are pros and cons to this.

First, though, let me correct you on your correlation between the free spiritedness of our people and the "Pagan with a Catholic veneer" take on spirituality. It's more pragmatic than that. All of Spain, Portugal, Italy and Greece spent most of their modern history under the rule of a king, a queen, or a fascist dictator. Parts of Italy were, at different junctures in history, colonies or protectorates of the Austro-Hungarian and Spanish Empires, or the Papal States. The few "independent" monarchs left, like the Savoys of Turin or the Grand Dukes of Tuscany, were little more than puppets at the service of the Pope or one of the various empires (a practice so old, even Dante talks about it in his Divine Comedy).

Being, for countless centuries, under the rule of a non-democratic power, so far detached from the needs and want of the general people, made us develop a set of coping mechanisms design to make our lives easier and more productive. What you call "free spirit" of the Mediterranean people is simply a more libertarian and libertine stance towards the general rules of a civilised community life. We think of ourselves and our immediate family before thinking of the greater good. We think of the best shortcut to a goal even if it's unethical or borderline illegal. We think of the best way to maximise profit while minimising work, or energy, spent.

To an external observer from a country where the Greater Good is felt as a strong obligation, like the UK and much of Northern Europe, an Italian, a Spaniard or Greek may well come across as happier and less preoccupied by the routines of life, more playful and vivacious, and more prone to non-conformist, hence "cooler" choices.

In reality, that happiness and happy-go-lucky attitude in life mainly comes from the relative well-being our parents and grand parents built for us. Make no mistake, ours (Gen X) is the last generation which will enjoy the fruit of the hard work of our previous generation, consequence-free. For the vast majority of us and those after us, there will be a lot less to smile and be relaxed about.

As someone who lived in the UK for 13 years before calling it a day and winding back into "the Mexico of Asia" (the Philippines), I can tell there is a long list of pros and cons. I never blended well with the Brits and their calculated distances, their compliant, yet reluctant, sense of togetherness, their hypocrisy. In the end the spring swung me back to more familiar feelings and a more familiar lifestyle. I failed to adapt.

[Winston]

@Lucas88
Yes! That's the word I was looking for. Vivaciousness. That's how they act. I couldn't put my finger on it. That word describes what I mean well. Anglos and Americans aren't passionate and vivacious like that. You see what I mean too? It's not just my imagination then.

@publicduende
Yeah I know you talked about that movie before. But how do you explain how Greeks seem so vivacious and authentic and passionate in a way you NEVER see in Americans? They must have amazing camaraderie and the best family get togethers that are wild and full of passion. Wow. Are Italian families like that too? If so you are lucky PD. Aren't your Italian family get togethers full of warmth, passion, energy, vitality, and vivaciousness? Lol

Are Italians similar to Greeks and Spanish? How are they similar and how are they different?

[kangarunner]

@Lucas88
Anglos and Americans aren't passionate and vivacious like that. You see what I mean too? It's not just my imagination then.

@Winston One reason I love this site is because there's so much truth on it. No, Americans are loud, passionate, and vivacious except when Americans do it, it's in a clown like way. Fake, not real.

Americans are a bunch of plastic clowns. Everyone is pretending.

[publicduende]

@publicduende
Yeah I know you talked about that movie before. But how do you explain how Greeks seem so vivacious and authentic and passionate in a way you NEVER see in Americans? They must have amazing camaraderie and the best family get togethers that are wild and full of passion. Wow. Are Italian families like that too? If so you are lucky PD. Aren't your Italian family get togethers full of warmth, passion, energy, vitality, and vivaciousness? Lol

Are Italians similar to Greeks and Spanish? How are they similar and how are they different?

@Winston

Greeks and Italians are not the same, and thanks Heaven!

Greek people are usually a lot more edgy, moody, volatile. They also tend to be more arrogant, as if their glorious ancient past gave them some sort of birth right to feel superior. The few "good" Greeks I met in my life were all in London, people of the diaspora who were born outside Greece or had all of their formative years in a different country.

We are somewhat closer to our Spaniard cousins. And even then, a Castellano (from Madrid) is not the same as a Catalano (from Barcelona), the same way someone from Milan is not the same as someone from Sicily.

You keep talking and reasoning by stereotypes, Winston. I mean, it's nice to generalise over time and space, trying to sustain an argument everybody agrees on (you keep smashing the open door here). It's a bit more misleading when you tend to idolise or feel nostalgic about something that might only have existed in fiction, or in a distant past, if ever.

A movie is a movie, a representation, more or less fictional, of a very specific set-up of a society, in time and space. If one binge-watches Happy Days, Friends or even That 70s Show now, the idea they will get about American youth is that they're f*cking awesome: nice, friendly, helping each other when it matters, family oriented but also committed to a good friendship, always ready to hang out, cool, handsome/hot, etc.

We all know the US people of today are far from those representation. It's the same with Italian movies that make you think Italy is that forever sunny land of friendly, good looking people good for talking football or Marxist philosophy, a place where a random bus ride comes with erotic situations like these...



There are indeed differences between the cultures of Europe and that diversity is (and will always be) our richness, despite certain transnational institutions made up by corrupt, unelected bureausaurs, want to make it disappear under the "united Europe" banner.

Yet, every culture comes with a long list of pros and cons. Italian, Greeks, Maltese, Spaniards, the whole lot. Having met people from a lot of places and from all kinds of walks of life, I can only say that the best approach is to always look at the person, rather than where they come from, or what language they speak.