Why can't Asians hold deeper intellectual conversations? Why are they never interested in higher truth or philosophy?

[Marcus Aurelius]

Winston those are some interesting questions, I'm not sure what to say. Lol you are asian!

Though Christian I have devoted my life to the study of religious thought, and I can earnestly say that eastern philosophy and religion is absolutely profound and captivating. Taoism, Confucianism, and for me ESPECIALLY Buddhism.

I have read volumes and volumes of Buddhist scriptures and writings...and it has had such a deep impact on my life that, I more or less live AS a Buddhist. I've meditated with Buddhist monks before too, talked to them....lol try talking to monks...they are some of the most brilliant people I've ever met...and it's not intelligence...it's wisdom...there is a difference.

But as to the points, I think the problem simply lies with how shallow essentially everyone is. I wouldn't single out asians, as you see this sort of surface level only thought..in almost every culture. I think what it really boils down to is this: both technology and the fast paced life revolving around work culture in most industrialized nations has made it so that the general populace is no longer capable of introspection which destroys the capacity to possess higher thought.

Most people are running on an endless treadmill, appearing that they are moving forward when in fact they are still in one place, not knowing they can simply turn the machine off..and get down.

[Rock]

Winston those are some interesting questions, I'm not sure what to say. Lol you are asian!

Though Christian I have devoted my life to the study of religious thought, and I can earnestly say that eastern philosophy and religion is absolutely profound and captivating. Taoism, Confucianism, and for me ESPECIALLY Buddhism.

I have read volumes and volumes of Buddhist scriptures and writings...and it has had such a deep impact on my life that, I more or less live AS a Buddhist. I've meditated with Buddhist monks before too, talked to them....lol try talking to monks...they are some of the most brilliant people I've ever met...and it's not intelligence...it's wisdom...there is a difference.

But as to the points, I think the problem simply lies with how shallow essentially everyone is. I wouldn't single out asians, as you see this sort of surface level only thought..in almost every culture. I think what it really boils down to is this: both technology and the fast paced life revolving around work culture in most industrialized nations has made it so that the general populace is no longer capable of introspection which destroys the capacity to possess higher thought.

Most people are running on an endless treadmill, appearing that they are moving forward when in fact they are still in one place, not knowing they can simply turn the machine off..and get down.

Thanks for your fresh perspective. Best post I've read in awhile.

Many of us western educated (uni level or above) guys often talk of Asians (esp east Asians) being rote learners, uncreative, just able to follow rules and execute orders, weak in verbal logic, and generally boring and square. Sure, many east Asians do tend to appear this way at first glance. But from my experience in 3 different multi-cultural workplaces (all Asian based), the Asian way often prevails in the longer term, both in Asian and western markets. I've seen profound creativity out of Asian colleagues and an amazing sixth sense as to what big clients, bosses, etc. are thinking and the ability to empathize with them no matter what their nationality or race is. It also seems to me that east Asians also tend to be expert readers of body language. On the other hand, the macho independent cowboy style of many self styled 'big western business men' often ends-up making them look like asses in a multi-cultural business environments which include Asians.

Sure, maybe we westerners, esp. Brits from certain privileged backgrounds are better at talking fancy and smart, at least in English. Many of us are conversant in a broad range topics and can speak intelligently about them. Does that mean we are more creative? Not necessarily.

As for the Asian arts, perhaps you need to be more immersed in the culture to truly begin to appreciate them. Poetry, literature, philosophy, painting, and religion from Asia is profound. As Bob Dylan said, "Don't criticize what you don't understand".

From another perspective, perhaps we are also stuck in our own kind of box. The truly enlightened probably look us and shake their heads.

[globetrotter]

"See, when Chinese/Taiwanese writers criticize christianity, they do it from their own Han-Chinese cultural context, because they're not banana like you! From their polytheist perspective, christians are rather poor with only 1 god, and good heavens, who cares about some dude name moses who was too stupid to bring a GPS or ask for directions, or jacob who didn't understand caveat emptor after slaving 7 years for his father in law. Poor jacob should've shopped in an Asian street market and learned how to bargain. "

Which happened upon the scene 1,000 years after Daoism, 500 years after Kongzi, 300 years after Buddhism and on and on...

Those who criticize China are shown the door or kicked out or on 'a list'.
Look up what happened to the ESL teacher and blogger 'Chinabounder.blogspot'. His antics are likely why blogspot is blocked.

China has been through this before. About 30 times, I think. So now it is turn #31 for them to be on the top of the empire heap until 2200. They ( or India...) were 40% of the world's GDP for most of the past 4,000 years, and they are headed back there, again.

Better adjust, fellas.

[momopi]

During the height of Ming Dynasty, China had roughly 1/3rd of the world populaton (150 million out of 450 million) and held estimated 29.2%-31% of the world economy. During Qing Dynasty in 1800, China had about 35% of world population and 30% of world economy.

Today, the size of China's economy and that of Japan is roughly the same (>$5 trillion USD), while China has 19.5% of the world population, vs. Japan has 1.86% of the world population. ~$5 trillion USD is roughly equal to 8.6% of the total world economy ($58 trillion).

The size of India's economy today is about same as Russia's ($1.2-$1.3T), or 1/4th of China/Japan. However, India has 17.3% of the world population, versus Russia has 2.07% of the world population.

China's economic development over the past 20 years has been specular, but realistically speaking, there's still a lot of catching up to developed nations. India is even further behind.

Despite China's population, there are areas experiencing labor shortage. I think in the next decade, we'll see young migrant workers from countries like Tajikistan, who traditionally travels to Russia to work as laborers, going to China to look for work in areas with labor shortage. China has invested heavily with its SCO political alliance, in addition to the "go west" domestic investment strategy to off-set regional minority dominance. I think we should expect decent amount of economic activity from its western frontier in the future. Just a difference perspective from the "coastal" development trend.



http://www.smh.com.au/travel/travel-new ... -pvvd.html
High-speed rail plan to link China to Europe

China is in negotiations with 17 countries to build a high-speed rail network to India and Europe with trains capable of running at more than 320 km/h within the next 10 years.

One network would run from London to Beijing and then to Singapore, according to Wang Mengshu, a member of the Chinese Academy of Engineering.

A second project would carry trains through Russia to Germany and into the European railway system, and a third line would extend south to connect Vietnam, Thailand, Burma and Malaysia.

[Marcus Aurelius]

Going a little further from what I said earlier, I'm reading a book by my favorite Christian writer, the Trappist monk Thomas Merton..and I think this sums up what I, what we, are talking about here:

"Those who claim to be educated are in reality not formed: they are formless bundles of unrelated factual knowledge, disoriented and passive, superficially acquainted with names, dates, facts, and with the "how" of various material processes. But they have know way of using what they "know." It is knowledge without possession of knowledge.

"The modern child may in the beginning of his conscious life begin to show natural and spontaneous signs of spirituality, of creativity and imagination. He may have individual freshness of response to reality, and even a tendency to moments of thoughtful silence and absorption. But all these qualities are quickly destroyed by the fears, anxieties, and compulsions to conform which come at him from all directions. At an early age interior life is all but eradicated."

[Winston]

Momopi,
Here is a list of people who say that I am very unique and freethinking. It includes two people who are very respected on this forum, Ladislav and Larry Elterman, as well as Steve Hoca and others. It is beyond obvious that I am VERY unique from other Asians. Why don't you like to admit that? Is it against your nature to give such compliments? Why not be honest and truthful like the others were? I mean I give you compliments and credit where it is due, so why can't you do the same?

Surely you are not trying to argue that I'm a common Asian are you???


http://www.happierabroad.com/FreethinkingAsian.pdf

"You're probably the most atypical Asian male I've ever met." - Peter, an old Scottish traveler I met in Estonia who's been to nearly 100 countries

“I would say that yes, I have not seen even one Asian person like yourself. There are rebellious types and these are women often, and they rebel by joining the American mainstream. Same with Asian guys who start acting “American�. But for an Asian to rebel not only against Asia but against America because it is TOO repressed for your taste, that is really taking the cake. To most Asians America is synonymous with a loud free place where you can shed your inhibitions.�
– Ladislav, my Expat Advisor and author of Expatriate Insights and Expatriate Observations, who has been to 30 countries and speaks 10 languages

“As far as you being a banana – a white man trapped in an Asian body - I would like to qualify that you are not an American white man inside an Asian body but a European Existentialist - a Frenchman, Italian or Spaniard trapped in an Asian body. You are certainly not a modern Anglo-Saxon trapped in it.� - Ladislav

“Despite all the flak you get you are certainly an interesting character and probably the most famous (or infamous) self-made asian on the internet� – Rob, USA

"Most Asians don't think for themselves. They simply follow the pack. You are one of the exceptions."
- Jean, Colorado

“Winston, you are a White man trapped in an Asian man's body. All the characteristics I associate with Asian men seem to be the opposite of you. You do not do what society tells you to do. You do not work hard just for the sake of working hard. You find White women attractive.� – Jean, Colorado

“I enjoy your writing and you are one of the most inspiring dudes around. Main thing is you don't give a shit what other people (especially white) say about you - highly unusual, unfortunately, for any race of people, Chinese especially. So your stuff is absolutely awesome.� – John, USA

“What I also love about this ebook is Winston's philosophical view of the world. I have never in my life seen an Asian guy with such a brilliant, philosophical mind. There have been times when I thought I was crazy thinking the way I was thinking, especially as it pertains to America and its awful, non-inclusive culture. However, after reading Winston's words, I totally feel relieved and vindicated, knowing full and well it's society that is crazy, not me!� – Steve Hoca, in his Amazon.com Review of my Ebook Happier Abroad

“I've met a few Asians that are open minded, but you're probably the most, so I can see why you feel that way....� – Jason Valenti of SasquatchResearch.net

�It’s true I have not met any Asians as free thinking as you, but I assume they exist somewhere.� – Larry Elterman, expat in Asia and author of A Man’s Guide to Life and Love in the Philippines

[Winston]

I think it is better to keep conversation very light. Some people take their politics, religion, etc way too personally and will attempt to even physically assault you if you disagree. Maybe Asians have a deeper understanding of this and thus avoid serious topics like these.

It would be hard to believe that Asian men are entirely as shallow as WWu paints them.

They are materialistic, live to work, and can't think outside the box. I've met hundreds like this. Even if they are nice, they are still only able to understand practical things.

Want to call my TW friend Ken and talk to him? He's very nice, but he can't talk about intellectual stuff.

Work is his only purpose in life.

Ladislav says that most Asian guys he knows are happy to not think and just work in a noodle shop everyday.

Where have you been?

[Winston]

The fact is, over 99 percent of Asians can't think outside the box. We all know that. Even Ladislav and Mr. S report the same observation.
So why do you take personal offense at such a statement, when it's obvious?

Gee, could it be that when Ladislav and Mr. S comment on something, they don't ask for an Asian author who is "critical to Asian cultures", then append the following conditions:

1. The author must be "friends and family", then you'll probably ask "must live within radius of x miles"
2. The written material must be "blogs by friends and family", like as if my cousins have nothing else better to do
3. The written material must contain philosophy, psychology, "freethinking", and anything else you add just to win an argument
4. The written material must be on the "same wavelength" as Mark Twain, Sigmund Freud, and anyone else you can add to win the argument
5. It must be "out of the box" by your ever changing standards
6. It must debunk every major argument of Christian fundamentalism, so if someone does produce a critique, you can say "it doesn't address argument #62"!
7. When my neighbor blogs in tranche de vie, you expect their writing to be on par with Mark Twain,
8. Worse of all, you expect Asian author to write in English, as if they're writing for your benefit, from your own cultural context.

Ok I'll make it simple then. Show me just ONE Asian blogger who thinks a lot outside the box, does not conform, is philosphical, can think abstractly, does not follow the herd, thinks independently rather than what society tells him. This person must demonstrate it in their content.

For example, look at Darryl Sloan's work. His videos show that he is a true freethinker, skeptic, and truthseeker and very deep thinker. There's no question about it.

http://www.youtube.com/user/darrylsloan

Can you find any Asian like him? I'll bet not.

Or how about this:

Find any other Asian whom a lot of people claim is unique and more freethinking than other Asians, as in the quotes I showed you above about me.

Is that easy enough?

[Winston]

I think it is better to keep conversation very light. Some people take their politics, religion, etc way too personally and will attempt to even physically assault you if you disagree. Maybe Asians have a deeper understanding of this and thus avoid serious topics like these.

It would be hard to believe that Asian men are entirely as shallow as WWu paints them.

Depends on what you mean by shallow. But 99 percent of them do not seem to have any independent free thought.

How about this?

I'll PM you the email addresses of 5 Asian males, including some of my cousins and family friends. They are all very nice humble people. Some grew up in the US too. You can tell them you know me and just want to do some culture exchange.

You start a conversation with them and try to make it as intellectual as you can, ask intellectual questions, etc. and tell me if they have any independent free thought. Ok?

If they have no free thoughts at all, then you'll see what I mean.

Anyone interested?

[Winston]

Winston those are some interesting questions, I'm not sure what to say. Lol you are asian!

Though Christian I have devoted my life to the study of religious thought, and I can earnestly say that eastern philosophy and religion is absolutely profound and captivating. Taoism, Confucianism, and for me ESPECIALLY Buddhism.

I have read volumes and volumes of Buddhist scriptures and writings...and it has had such a deep impact on my life that, I more or less live AS a Buddhist. I've meditated with Buddhist monks before too, talked to them....lol try talking to monks...they are some of the most brilliant people I've ever met...and it's not intelligence...it's wisdom...there is a difference.

But as to the points, I think the problem simply lies with how shallow essentially everyone is. I wouldn't single out asians, as you see this sort of surface level only thought..in almost every culture. I think what it really boils down to is this: both technology and the fast paced life revolving around work culture in most industrialized nations has made it so that the general populace is no longer capable of introspection which destroys the capacity to possess higher thought.

Most people are running on an endless treadmill, appearing that they are moving forward when in fact they are still in one place, not knowing they can simply turn the machine off..and get down.

Yes I'm Asian, but I'm unusually truthful. Can't you see?

What other Asian would say "How come other Asians have no freethought and are like robots?"

Do you know even one Asian who would say something like that?

See what I mean?

So why the hell are some here contesting that I am unique? Are they claiming that I am a common asian? LOL

Btw, yeah Buddhist monks are very philosophical. But they must conform to their monastery rules and religion. Religion causes you to close your mind and edit your reality, so that you only accept that which agrees with your religion.

They are probably the only philosophical Asians that I know of though.

[momopi]

Ok I'll make it simple then. Show me just ONE Asian blogger who thinks a lot outside the box, does not conform, is philosphical, can think abstractly, does not follow the herd, thinks independently rather than what society tells him. This person must demonstrate it in their content.

Let's review the terms and conditions:

1) Asian
2) Blogger
3) Thinks a lot outside the box
4) Does not conform
5) Is philosophical
6) Thinks abstractly
7) Does not follow the herd
8 ) Thinks independently
9) Doesn't do what society tells him
10) Demonstrate with written content

"Simple" ?

Simple, is "show me a book written by Asian sci-fi author, in space opera style".

Simple, is "show me a painting by contemporary Chinese surrealist artist".

Simple, is "bring me a Sauvignon Blanc that is like a sunny field."

[Winston]

Let's review the terms and conditions:

1) Asian
2) Blogger
3) Thinks a lot outside the box
4) does not conform
5) is philosophical
6) thinks abstractly
7) does not follow the herd
thinks independently
9) not what society tells him
10) demonstrate with written content

Is that your idea of "simple" ?

Sure, Darryl Sloan fits that list. Why can't an Asian fit that? Asians are very diverse right? So it should be easy to find one that fits those criteria right? I found an Irish guy that does. Why not an Asian?

How about finding one who just thinks outside the box, beyond what society and establishment institutions tell him? Is that easy enough?

[momopi]

How about finding one who just thinks outside the box, beyond what society and establishment institutions tell him? Is that easy enough?

Try 韓寒 (Han Han), he is considered one of the most popular blogger in China. Most of his works are published in Chinese language only, but a few articles have been translated to English:

http://www.hanhandigest.com/?p=84

(Read this article to understand the term "Harmonized" used in article: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Harmonius_society)


Info:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Han_Han


He wrote this short essay at age 15. You can show it to your parents and ask them what they think:

http://tieba.baidu.com/f?kz=6029315

Momopi,
Here is a list of people who say that I am very unique and freethinking. It includes two people who are very respected on this forum, Ladislav and Larry Elterman, as well as Steve Hoca and others. It is beyond obvious that I am VERY unique from other Asians. Why don't you like to admit that? Is it against your nature to give such compliments? Why not be honest and truthful like the others were? I mean I give you compliments and credit where it is due, so why can't you do the same?
Surely you are not trying to argue that I'm a common Asian are you???

Save your self-promotion for selling ebooks. I gave praises when you got off your butt and went abroad. Talk is cheap, and action speaks louder than words. If you want praises, get out of the house and do something with your life. If you want recognition, work harder at your chosen field or project. If you're looking for attention, get a GF.

[ladislav]

I think most Asian intelligent conversations are carried out in their language, not in English.
Places like Taiwan may not be intellectual strongholds given the history behind it- mostly capitalist refugees from the Mainland. Asian Americans are Americans and more practical versions of the same. They are in the US to do business and to get technical education.
I guess to hold an intellectual conversation, you need to be in the right circles, in the right Asian country and to speak the right Asian language.

[Winston]

Momopi,
Here is a list of people who say that I am very unique and freethinking. It includes two people who are very respected on this forum, Ladislav and Larry Elterman, as well as Steve Hoca and others. It is beyond obvious that I am VERY unique from other Asians. Why don't you like to admit that? Is it against your nature to give such compliments? Why not be honest and truthful like the others were? I mean I give you compliments and credit where it is due, so why can't you do the same?
Surely you are not trying to argue that I'm a common Asian are you???

Save your self-promotion for selling ebooks. I gave praises when you got off your butt and went abroad. Talk is cheap, and action speaks louder than words. If you want praises, get out of the house and do something with your life. If you want recognition, work harder at your chosen field or project. If you're looking for attention, get a GF.

I am all about action. You should know that by now. Everything I've said it backed up, which is why I have credibility. I do what I say. My work online attests to my insight and freethinking. I already have tons of recognition, such as in the quotes I showed you. I was just wondering why you can't admit that I am definitely very unique, when other honest people can. Why is that so hard? Why the psychological block? I give credit where it's due. And I compliment you justly too. I am honest and fair about it.