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Why MGTOW can be potentially dangerous to young men

Vent your rants and raves here about whatever makes you mad, angry or frustrated.

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Yohan
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Re: Why MGTOW can be potentially dangerous to young men

Post by Yohan » December 8th, 2017, 1:56 pm

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Re: Why MGTOW can be potentially dangerous to young men

Post by Yohan » December 8th, 2017, 2:11 pm

mattyman wrote:
December 5th, 2017, 4:42 pm

Who posts on MGTOW?
  • Guys who've gotten out of bad relationships
  • Guys who've experienced unrequited love
  • Guy's who're frustrated because of only being seen as 'friends' by women they've found attractive
  • Sex addicts
----------

Now, it's true that there are lots of inequities in our society and many ways that men are treated unfairly (e.g. the ever lowering bar on what's considered sexual harrassment, discrimination against men) that do need open discussion .....
Well if men who finally managed to get away from a bad relationship and think about how to avoid such a mistake in future, what is wrong with that?

I never heard about MGTOWs who are sex-addicts - they are more the opposite if you ask me as they look for other entertainment where they can avoid contact with malicious women but also with strange men who want to teach them about what is right and what is wrong for them.

At least you acknowledge that there is a lot of injustice going on against men - but why do you not care about that?

Open discussion, are you making fun out of this issue, or are you dreaming? You know very well, that an open discussion about men's rights is not possible - post anything about disadvantages concerning men on any Western public website and it will be deleted within a few hours.

Even women, who were actively starting to care about men, found themselves badly treated by the present toxic Western communities and their biased media..


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Re: Why MGTOW can be potentially dangerous to young men

Post by Yohan » December 8th, 2017, 2:59 pm

MrMan wrote:
December 5th, 2017, 6:43 pm
There were even some feminists who supported lesbianism and advocated it as a natural outgrowth of feminism. I haven't heard of gay MGTOWs, men who turned gay because women were so bad. But I wouldn't be surprised if we heard about that soon.
I remember a few gay men who were showing up in typical MGTOW forum, talking to me, were asking for some information and they found it boring, not fitting their agenda and after a few comments they all left.

There is nothing in common between straight MGTOW and gay men. Their life-style is quite different, they are not straight men.

About straight men turning gay, this is nonsense. Even if women in general treated you badly as long as you can think back in your entire life, believe me you will still turn out as a straight man and not become gay. Please note that I said women in general and not girlfriend or ex-wife.

Women in general means any woman you had close contact with - could be your mother, your sister, your daughter, female co-workers, female class-mates and so on...

It is a big mistake of people who are posting nonsense about MGTOW that they always point out a possible relationship between a MGTOW man vs. a woman he had a sexual relationship.

In many cases men turning to MGTOW out of any other reason and not because of missing sex.

Here in Asia many young man like this idea of MGTOW solely because of economic consideration. Other (like I myself) had horrible experiences with females when they were still children, even prepubertal children. How can you blame them to be mistrusting against women?

There is also this idiotic slander going on - of course without offering any evidence - that MGTOWs are hating ALL women.

MGTOW are not hating women, but they are risk-averse or even afraid of any contact with a certain group of females and worried - often because of the legal situation - that such females might take advantage and harm them. This is not a phobia, it happens in real life all the time that men are misused, nobody can deny that, and the financial damage done is almost always with the man who has to pay the bill, often over decades.

May I ask you something?
What is wrong if a woman approached by a man says NO? Please answer this question. Likely your answer might be 'nothing is wrong, if she does not want, so she does not want'.

What is wrong if a man approached by a woman says NO? Please answer this question. I presume your answer might be 'woman hater' or similar BS.

However as a MGTOW I think, I have a right to reject certain women if I feel worried and insecure with them - why shall I socialize with them if I don't want that and if I feel uncomfortable with their presence close to me?

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Re: Why MGTOW can be potentially dangerous to young men

Post by Nomad » February 7th, 2018, 3:05 pm

I have to agree with the original poster. I was a MGTOW for 5-7 years. It was November 2010 when I was first introduced. I read MGTOW forums everyday and I still have a couple bookmarked on my phone when I'm really bored. Those were times when MGTOW was hardly known and people like Stardust and Barbarossa were seen as leaders in the movement and Nacho was in charge of the most popular mgtow forum at the time before he took it down himself.

I have to say those were good and bad years for me. Good because I learned about toxic women and female manipulation, but bad because I only grew more bitter and angrier as read report after report of men getting screwed over.

Eventually I hit a tipping point and swore to never get married, but not only that, my health declined because I was constantly angry all the time. For me, I just knew that there was no "good girls" out there anymore in this toxic society.

Then I met a christian girl online who lived in Finland. She was a virgin who didn't whore or slut around. Well that was interesting, I thought. Most girls lose their virginity at 14 and she was 22. Mind you, she isn't ugly by any-word of the imagination. I was trying to sleep with a 5 in America who snobbed her nose up at me, and here was a 9 who fell in love with me.

But, I had my MGTOW philosophy finely grained in my head. Okay, she is a virgin, but SOMETHING has got to be wrong with her. There has got to be a catch. She was a tall girl and i'm 4 inches shorter than her, so I thought, okay we can be friends because girls ONLY want taller guys. She still chose me. I thought, okay maybe its because I have money? But I didn't have any real money (1k in savings?). Perhaps a green-card to America? No mention of it.

Maybe she is a false christian who only claims to worship God and put on a act? Goes to church and actively deeply worships him. Buys me little gifts and writes love notes all the time. At our wedding, she sung me a love song, and made all sorts of films for me.

Truthfully, I scored out big time. The MGTOW philosophy is good for detecting bad women, but here was before me a GEM, and what would I do? Say that ALL WOMEN are bad and reject a good thing? I have never regretting marrying my wife. She is also anti-feminist and pro-male, so that is always a good thing. I never been happier.

I cannot advocate MGTOW to men. Not because I think MGTOW's are wrong. I do think they have good knowledge on women, but their attitudes about it are terrible.

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Re: Why MGTOW can be potentially dangerous to young men

Post by Man With a Plan » February 11th, 2018, 6:19 pm

^ Above poster gets it right. Mgtow can drop a few gems every once in a while, because even a broken clock is right twice a day, after all. But it's not a healthy lifestyle. End of story.
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Re: Why MGTOW can be potentially dangerous to young men

Post by Moretorque » February 13th, 2018, 11:53 pm

Nomad wrote:
February 7th, 2018, 3:05 pm
I have to agree with the original poster. I was a MGTOW for 5-7 years. It was November 2010 when I was first introduced. I read MGTOW forums everyday and I still have a couple bookmarked on my phone when I'm really bored. Those were times when MGTOW was hardly known and people like Stardust and Barbarossa were seen as leaders in the movement and Nacho was in charge of the most popular mgtow forum at the time before he took it down himself.

I have to say those were good and bad years for me. Good because I learned about toxic women and female manipulation, but bad because I only grew more bitter and angrier as read report after report of men getting screwed over.

Eventually I hit a tipping point and swore to never get married, but not only that, my health declined because I was constantly angry all the time. For me, I just knew that there was no "good girls" out there anymore in this toxic society.

Then I met a christian girl online who lived in Finland. She was a virgin who didn't whore or slut around. Well that was interesting, I thought. Most girls lose their virginity at 14 and she was 22. Mind you, she isn't ugly by any-word of the imagination. I was trying to sleep with a 5 in America who snobbed her nose up at me, and here was a 9 who fell in love with me.

But, I had my MGTOW philosophy finely grained in my head. Okay, she is a virgin, but SOMETHING has got to be wrong with her. There has got to be a catch. She was a tall girl and i'm 4 inches shorter than her, so I thought, okay we can be friends because girls ONLY want taller guys. She still chose me. I thought, okay maybe its because I have money? But I didn't have any real money (1k in savings?). Perhaps a green-card to America? No mention of it.

Maybe she is a false christian who only claims to worship God and put on a act? Goes to church and actively deeply worships him. Buys me little gifts and writes love notes all the time. At our wedding, she sung me a love song, and made all sorts of films for me.

Truthfully, I scored out big time. The MGTOW philosophy is good for detecting bad women, but here was before me a GEM, and what would I do? Say that ALL WOMEN are bad and reject a good thing? I have never regretting marrying my wife. She is also anti-feminist and pro-male, so that is always a good thing. I never been happier.

I cannot advocate MGTOW to men. Not because I think MGTOW's are wrong. I do think they have good knowledge on women, but their attitudes about it are terrible.
I am glad you found that special someone, obviously she was perfect because Nomad has had to sterilize all life it has ever encountered to this point for imperfections.

Now if we can just find someone for Droid....... :wink:
Last edited by Moretorque on February 15th, 2018, 1:02 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Why MGTOW can be potentially dangerous to young men

Post by yick » February 14th, 2018, 4:47 am

MGTOW is the only chance (for some sensible and intelligent men...) to get a woman.

If a man decides to MGTOW and go and play video games, then he will remain on his own for the rest of his life.

If a man learns skills, learns languages, travels, gets fit, gets strong - he'll have a choice of women.

Up to you.

It's no use at getting angry at people giving out advice, not all advice out there is applicable to you. You have to pick and choose what applies and what doesn't apply to you.

The men who are 'leading lives of quiet desperation' are usually married and kids, because they had sex before they matured fully and are now working and living lives they hate to upkeep wives and kids they don't want any more and that they basically can't afford.

If you are not that person, thank your lucky stars you escaped.

Stop being bitter and angry, women will come when your life is on point and that my friends - is down to you.

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Re: Why MGTOW can be potentially dangerous to young men

Post by Yohan » February 16th, 2018, 6:38 am

Nomad wrote:
February 7th, 2018, 3:05 pm
.....
I have to say those were good and bad years for me. Good because I learned about toxic women and female manipulation, but bad because I only grew more bitter and angrier as read report after report of men getting screwed over.

.....
Truthfully, I scored out big time. The MGTOW philosophy is good for detecting bad women, but here was before me a GEM, and what would I do? Say that ALL WOMEN are bad and reject a good thing? I have never regretting marrying my wife. She is also anti-feminist and pro-male, so that is always a good thing. I never been happier.

I cannot advocate MGTOW to men. Not because I think MGTOW's are wrong. I do think they have good knowledge on women, but their attitudes about it are terrible.
It is nice to read you find a honest woman, however it should be said, not in your own native country, and you are not living now in your own native country either, right?

Same as me, I am not living in Europe anymore, but in Asia. However I consider myself still as MGTOW, even banned Contrarian Expat said, I am clearly MGTOW. I made a lot of contributions by comments, but also financially, to keep a MGTOW Forum running on the internet since more than 10 years.

MGTOW are against malicious women whose wrongdoing is protected by law in Western countries by feminist ideology.
MGTOW are NOT against ALL women, but against feminism.


.....
here was before me a GEM
.....

Well, openly said, not all men who have good intention are lucky to find a 'GEM', many of them are disappointed and are made bankrupt more than one time by malicious women, believe me. Please consider that.

About getting bitter and angry, this is not the way of MGTOW. It is about being happy even in case you cannot find your 'GEM'.

their attitudes about it are terrible

This is not everywhere the case, and happens mainly in USA, UK and Australia. It is merely the rude response to rude females, often the only language bad females understand.

MGTOW in Germany for example are much more polite, however their publications are in German, not in English.
Also here in Japan, so-called herbivore men who are nothing but MGTOW mainly out of financial reason and the lack of females willing to marry, do not have a problem to interact with females in a friendly way.

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Re: Why MGTOW can be potentially dangerous to young men

Post by Yohan » February 17th, 2018, 9:28 am



This is a book that gives women step by step approach to destroy a man's career with accusations of sexual harassment and no evidence. The book is available for purchase on amazon

-----

The point is that MGTOWs do not remain silent, somebody must do the dirty work and to expose malicious women.
We need MGTOW, even if there is the opinion somehow that their attitude is 'terrible'.

How it works in Western feminist countries, this book gives you a good advice...
Of course not all women will take advantage of the legal situation, but some do....

Interesting to see that it is fine to complain about MGTOW all the time, but such provocative books giving advice how to attack innocent men can be published without facing any critics.

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Re: Why MGTOW can be potentially dangerous to young men

Post by flowerthief00 » February 23rd, 2018, 7:30 am

The game of dating & courtship from the point of view of a man living in today's society is like having a carrot dangled in front of you which is pulled away every time you reach for it then returned to its original position as if to mock you. No matter how much energy, time, money, sanity you expend you can't seem to get a bite out of the damn carrot. But maybe one day through a fluke of luck you do manage to take a bite. Your moment of triumph is short-lived as the carrot is revealed to be moldy and contaminated, has other bite marks on it, and makes you sick to the point of collapse. Long after the carrot is removed from your presence for good, the sickness persists, eating away at even your motivation for living. But we all must strive to pursue the carrot. It will be SO worth it in the end!

However, there are some who decide not to pursue the carrot and just get on with their lives: MGTOW.

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Re: Why MGTOW can be potentially dangerous to young men

Post by mattyman » February 26th, 2018, 12:13 am

It's this view that ALL relationships must be bad, that ALL women are this, and that anyone who disagrees with the collective 'truth' has got something wrong with them.

Yes, malicious women need exposing, false rape accusations need exposing, gender stereotyping of men needs exposing, but that doesn't mean we can throw the baby out with the bathwater.

I agree nomad
I cannot advocate MGTOW to men. Not because I think MGTOW's are wrong. I do think they have good knowledge on women, but their attitudes about it are terrible.
It's this idea that bad experience with woman=all women must be the same; our (lizard) brain's tendency to over-generalize. I don't agree with telling younger guys nor who have many & points of reference to compare things to these messages about one whole sex could be potentially damaging.

RE inverse political correctness
Also I hate political correctness in all shapes and forms, whether it be by feminists shouting down people they don't agree with as 'mysogynists' or 'chauvinists' or Mens rights activists crying out 'simp' or 'mangina' to anything they don't agree with, it's the same thing. Claiming to advocate free speech and doing exactly the same as the feminazis; THAT'S GOT TO CHANGE. That behaviour just sends the message that all mens right activists are a bunch of hypocrites! That's not a message I want mens rights activism to have! There's a lack of moderate mens rights movements.

There appears to be an absence of men's right activists who're not 'red pill/blue pill, don't agree with us, you're not one of us your opinion doesn't matter'. There's a lack of sober and balanced, academic-style mens rights activism that doesn't frame the debate in terms of 'women are all evil'. There are both moderate and radical feminists, but there's a lack of moderate mens rights activism discussion. The only way things can change is if there's a more moderate movement (e.g. one that doesn't frame the debate as women are all evil, self-serving).

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Re: Why MGTOW can be potentially dangerous to young men

Post by Yohan » February 26th, 2018, 4:40 pm

mattyman wrote:
February 26th, 2018, 12:13 am
It's this view that ALL relationships must be bad, that ALL women are this, and that anyone who disagrees with the collective 'truth' has got something wrong with them.

Yes, malicious women need exposing, false rape accusations need exposing, gender stereotyping of men needs exposing, but that doesn't mean we can throw the baby out with the bathwater.
Who told you that MGTOWs consider ALL relationships with women must to be bad? Who told you that? A feminist posting some crap in a liberal forum I guess.

I know various members who are MGTOWs and who are married, but they are not living in Western countries anymore and their wife is not from Western countries. MGTOW means simply said, go your own way - away from the mainstream.

A question to you after reading your comment: How can you expose a false rape allegation, if the 'victim' (the female false accuser) has the right of anonymity for life?
How can you agree that the accused man, without any other proof but the word of the female accuser, will be published in the media with full personal data and picture?

If you do not agree with that legal issue you are automatically considered to be a misogynist by the Western pro-feminist media.

Full report see link below. What shall police and judges really do? They had no other choice but to prosecute innocent men and they were sent to jail for years. That's OK for you?

And do you really think, she will serve 10 years? I don't think so...

http://www.news.com.au/world/europe/the ... 04475d1509
A SERIAL rape accuser who claimed she had been sexually assaulted by 15 men in three years has been jailed after her sick lies were finally exposed.

A judge slammed Jemma Beale as a “convincing liar” and “manipulative” while sentencing her to ten years behind bars in the UK on Thursday.

The 25-year-old claimed she had been seriously sexually assaulted by six men and raped by nine, all strangers, in four different encounters over the space of three years.

She was found guilty in July at Southwark Crown Court of four counts of perjury and four counts of perverting the course of justice.

Sentencing her today, Judge Nicholas Loraine-Smith said: “This trial has revealed, what was then not obvious, that you are a very, very convincing liar and you enjoy being seen as a victim.

“The prosecution described your life as a ‘construct of bogus victim hood’.”

“DRUNKEN ATTEMPT FOR SYMPATHY”

Prosecutor Madeleine Moore told the court police spent 6400 hours investigating Beale’s claims at a cost of at least AUD $450,000, and the trial cost at least $177,000. Investigating Beale cost about AUD $390,000. The cost of other trials brought the total cost to taxpayers to AUD $1.45 million for her deceit.

Lawrence Henderson, defending, said Beale still maintains her innocence, and she was considering appealing against sentence.

He told the court: “Ms Beale stands by the claims she made in this matter and if she had her time again she would again plead not guilty to these matters and contest the trial.”

Beale from Bedfont, west London, sat with her arms crossed as she was jailed for a total of 10 years, with the judge branding her behaviour as “manipulative”

He said: “These offences usually began as a drunken attempt to get your partner’s sympathy or perhaps to arouse her jealousy.

“They each began impulsively, but what is particularly chilling is the manner in which you persisted in making allegations which you knew were untrue even to the extent of committing and repeating perjury.”

REAL VICTIMS AT RISK

He continued: “These false allegations of rape, false allegations which will inevitably be widely publicised, are likely to have the perverse impact of increasing the likelihood of guilty men going free.

“Cases such as this bring a real risk that a woman who has been raped or sexually assaulted may not complain to the police for fear of not being believed.”

Detectives launched an investigation into Beale in December 2013 after they learned of a claim by one of her former girlfriends that a man had been wrongly jailed after Beale lied about being raped by him in November 2010.

Police said the information came to light when officers were investigating a separate allegation by Beale, where she claimed to have been raped by a number of men during an incident in November 2013.

With concerns over Beale’s account, officers carried out a review of four investigations into allegations of rape and sexual assault made by Beale.

.....

FALSELY JAILED FOR SEVEN YEARS

The Metropolitan Police said one of the rape allegations made to police by Beale in 2010 led to the conviction of a man, Mahad Cassim, who was jailed for seven years.

After the CPS and his defence team were alerted to the fact there were serious doubts over the validity of Beale’s allegations, the man subsequently appealed against his conviction and it was quashed at the Court of Appeal in July 2015.

In a victim impact statement Mr Cassim told the court he had been hugely effected by the false claim.

He added: “One of my goals is to be a successful businessman, to have a nice family and be happy.

“I am working on the happiness — I have a long way to go.”

Beale had also falsely claimed that she was groped by a stranger, Noam Shahzad, in a pub in July 2012.

She said she was then gang-raped by him and a group of other men, and even injured herself to back up her claims she had been assaulted with barbed wire.

Beale then fabricated similar allegations against six other men in 2013.

She claimed two strangers sexually assaulted her close to her home before she was put through another gang rape attack by four others
https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/3962530/w ... en-jailed/

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Re: Why MGTOW can be potentially dangerous to young men

Post by Adama » February 26th, 2018, 5:56 pm

Yohan wrote:
February 17th, 2018, 9:28 am


This is a book that gives women step by step approach to destroy a man's career with accusations of sexual harassment and no evidence. The book is available for purchase on amazon

-----

The point is that MGTOWs do not remain silent, somebody must do the dirty work and to expose malicious women.
We need MGTOW, even if there is the opinion somehow that their attitude is 'terrible'.

How it works in Western feminist countries, this book gives you a good advice...
Of course not all women will take advantage of the legal situation, but some do....

Interesting to see that it is fine to complain about MGTOW all the time, but such provocative books giving advice how to attack innocent men can be published without facing any critics.
I must say, that anyone practicing to destroy an innocent person, whether either party is a man or a woman, is only seeking to destroy themselves.

I faced a false sexual harassment accusation at one job. This woman was a super whore, and we exchanged a few words. I found her physically attractive but she said she had a boyfriend and she was disrespectful towards me. It was hard to have a conversation with her and she would never speak or approach first. So I left her alone. After about a month, I started talking to another woman. She happened to see this.

Immediately after that, I hear the through grapevine that I have sexual harassed some girl. The other women knew before I knew. Turns out they were investigating behind the scenes. Then they interviewed me.

Turns out she was a whore. She had a boyfriend but she had already been involved with at least two other men in that workplace. Not every knew beforehand, but after she made the accusation, everyone knew she was a whore.

Also, the other women came to my side and gave her a hard time.

Then she dropped the accusation, and things resumed as they were. After that, it was revealed that I was the only man to ever withdraw himself from her. Apparently most men were willing to wait on her to be the next guy.

After I quit, she got pregnant, and she was simple-minded enough to let everyone know that she had no clue who the father was. Apparently she had slept around too much, and she couldn't figure it out.

Besides that, there is an eternal price of the soul that a person must pay forever, for giving someone a hassle when they've never done you any harm. Anyone attacking a meek and innocent person is at risk of eternal destruction, because God will not justify the wicked.

I had no idea that women's egos could be so massive that, even if you simply remove yourself from them and leave them alone, they will sometimes still come at you like a ravening wolf to devour your soul.

I've had some really bad experiences at the hands of women. I really have no idea what to do either, because porn and prostitutes are out of the question.
A good man is above pettiness. He is better than that.

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Re: Why MGTOW can be potentially dangerous to young men

Post by Yohan » February 26th, 2018, 11:58 pm

Adama wrote:
February 26th, 2018, 5:56 pm
I must say, that anyone practicing to destroy an innocent person, whether either party is a man or a woman, is only seeking to destroy themselves.

I faced a false sexual harassment accusation at one job.

.....

I had no idea that women's egos could be so massive that, even if you simply remove yourself from them and leave them alone, they will sometimes still come at you like a ravening wolf to devour your soul.

I've had some really bad experiences at the hands of women. I really have no idea what to do either, because porn and prostitutes are out of the question.
This is a very interesting comment from Adama.

MGTOWs advice is against feminism and not against women in general, and the question about the story from Adama is what happened to this woman AFTER it turned out there was no sexual harassment at all. My guess, nothing happened... so she did not destroy herself... feminism is protecting her.

MGTOWs give advice NEVER to date any woman at the workplace. Just say good morning when entering and good bye when leaving.
It's too risky, even if you have the best intention as a man. MGTOWs are risk-averse, you risk your job, just because you are trying to talk a few private words with a woman? - It''s not worth it... you never know what her reaction might be and nobody will protect you as a man in case of false accusations coming from a woman - for sure do not expect any help from any employer, especially not if the employer is a man as he is afraid of feminism himself.

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Re: Why MGTOW can be potentially dangerous to young men

Post by Zambales » February 27th, 2018, 12:51 am

Nomad wrote:
February 7th, 2018, 3:05 pm
I have to agree with the original poster. I was a MGTOW for 5-7 years. It was November 2010 when I was first introduced. I read MGTOW forums everyday and I still have a couple bookmarked on my phone when I'm really bored. Those were times when MGTOW was hardly known and people like Stardust and Barbarossa were seen as leaders in the movement and Nacho was in charge of the most popular mgtow forum at the time before he took it down himself.

I have to say those were good and bad years for me. Good because I learned about toxic women and female manipulation, but bad because I only grew more bitter and angrier as read report after report of men getting screwed over.

Eventually I hit a tipping point and swore to never get married, but not only that, my health declined because I was constantly angry all the time. For me, I just knew that there was no "good girls" out there anymore in this toxic society.

Then I met a christian girl online who lived in Finland. She was a virgin who didn't whore or slut around. Well that was interesting, I thought. Most girls lose their virginity at 14 and she was 22. Mind you, she isn't ugly by any-word of the imagination. I was trying to sleep with a 5 in America who snobbed her nose up at me, and here was a 9 who fell in love with me.

But, I had my MGTOW philosophy finely grained in my head. Okay, she is a virgin, but SOMETHING has got to be wrong with her. There has got to be a catch. She was a tall girl and i'm 4 inches shorter than her, so I thought, okay we can be friends because girls ONLY want taller guys. She still chose me. I thought, okay maybe its because I have money? But I didn't have any real money (1k in savings?). Perhaps a green-card to America? No mention of it.

Maybe she is a false christian who only claims to worship God and put on a act? Goes to church and actively deeply worships him. Buys me little gifts and writes love notes all the time. At our wedding, she sung me a love song, and made all sorts of films for me.

Truthfully, I scored out big time. The MGTOW philosophy is good for detecting bad women, but here was before me a GEM, and what would I do? Say that ALL WOMEN are bad and reject a good thing? I have never regretting marrying my wife. She is also anti-feminist and pro-male, so that is always a good thing. I never been happier.

I cannot advocate MGTOW to men. Not because I think MGTOW's are wrong. I do think they have good knowledge on women, but their attitudes about it are terrible.
Never shut the door completely is my philosophy when it comes to women & marriage. You didn't and you seem to have reaped the rewards. Nice one!

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