Self-Improvement Turned AW Away From Me

[marsatreus]

Let me tell you a little about myself before I get into this.
I am a 20 something male, average body, pretty face, and taller then average.
I used to have absolutely no problem finding women to have sex with or go on dates with. Between 17 and 22 I had sex with or dated 12 or so women. I was in "committed" relationships with them as I've always wanted to be a "good" guy.

I was engaged for 3 years and it was the biggest mistake of my life. From 17 to 22 I was a mess. I was pretty much always drunk or messed up in some way. Really low self esteem, constantly suicidal or depressed. I used to smoke a pack of cigarettes a day and wash it down with a bottle of rum almost every night.

What did I notice during this time?
I was constantly getting laid. Sometimes I would get drunk and text old girlfriends to come and buy me cigarettes and drink with me. They'd not only come over but they'd spend money out of their own pockets for the cigarettes! I treated them like dirt or errand girls and they were fine with it.

What changed?
I became a free thinker and a better person. I stopped drinking and smoking as much. I started to treat other people with respect because I finally respected myself.
Today I make really great wages and could live almost any life I'd want.

But what changed along with that?
I'm a nice guy now. Girls aren't attracted to me anymore. Before I used to get on dating sites and it was like shooting fish in a barrel. I wasn't very picky and it always worked out! Now I'm a cleaned up person with plenty of self esteem and women aren't interested. They'd prefer someone they can boss around who hates themselves.

Do not read the "GO FROM NERD TO HUNK!" posts. Women don't give a shit about any of that. I am attractive to women, with decent money. But once you have improved yourself you with expect a higher quality of women and it just won't be there. They will still expect you to pay for everything, listen to them be bitches, and be jealous about every little thing.

Don't believe that you need to change yourself to attract women. Change yourself to make yourself happy and nothing else. Women aren't worth any extra work. They should be here to support you when you need help after working 54 hours. Not the other way around.

I've come to the conclusion that with high self esteem and not wanting to put up with BS there is no women in America for me. They don't care how successful or attractive you are, they will still expect to be treated better then equal.

[mguy]

Sometimes the best self-improvement step you can take is to leave.

[Billy]

sounds like mgtow

[fightforlove]

Reading your post reminded me a bit of my own situation. I was a commited Protestant all through my twenties, went to church weekly, enthusiastically volunteered, tithed, prayed for others and followed the rules to the best of my ability. I would even go several weeks/months at a time without masturbating and then would feel miserably guilty when I'd slip up.

I could hardly swing a coffee date with a girl in those years. I was shy and socially awkward, but the whole being a hard-working young man and going to church thing sure didn't do nothing to help me either. I went through a crisis as I approached 30, I became very depressed about my inability to find a girlfriend and finally just quit caring--I continued to attend church, but I stopped volunteering, tithing and I also started whacking off daily without any fear or sense of guilt. I became more selfish with my time/money and started a self-improvement project and, boom, the flood gates opened and I started getting girls to accept my date offers and suddenly I had a vibrant dating life soon followed by my first long-term relationship.

So, your story kind of resembles mine only in reverse: I went from being a meek, selfless, sober church mouse to being more aggresive and self-involved with a dose of don't-give-a-f uck attitude and, low and behold, I finally started having success with women.

[Taco]

I've come to the conclusion that with high self esteem and not wanting to put up with BS there is no women in America for me.

You figured it all out faster than I did, it took me about 36 yrs. As long as you stay away from American women your success is guaranteed.

[marsatreus]

Reading your post reminded me a bit of my own situation. I was a commited Protestant all through my twenties, went to church weekly, enthusiastically volunteered, tithed, prayed for others and followed the rules to the best of my ability. I would even go several weeks/months at a time without masturbating and then would feel miserably guilty when I'd slip up.

I could hardly swing a coffee date with a girl in those years. I was shy and socially awkward, but the whole being a hard-working young man and going to church thing sure didn't do nothing to help me either. I went through a crisis as I approached 30, I became very depressed about my inability to find a girlfriend and finally just quit caring--I continued to attend church, but I stopped volunteering, tithing and I also started whacking off daily without any fear or sense of guilt. I became more selfish with my time/money and started a self-improvement project and, boom, the flood gates opened and I started getting girls to accept my date offers and suddenly I had a vibrant dating life soon followed by my first long-term relationship.

So, your story kind of resembles mine only in reverse: I went from being a meek, selfless, sober church mouse to being more aggresive and self-involved with a dose of don't-give-a-f uck attitude and, low and behold, I finally started having success with women.

It seems like the exact opposite for sure. Once I was trying to not be a dick my success dwindled to nothing. I'm going to say f**k it and just be who I am from now on and just say what I want to say.
I'm also probably going to find a lower paying less stressful income, where 30% of my money doesn't go to taxes.
I think we live in a bullshit system and I'm tired of carrying the countries burden on my back.

[Winston]

This is very revealing and a testament to what I said about how in America, bad is good and good is bad. Only a culture in decline and moral decay would be that way.

[Voice of Reason]

Interesting story, and thanks for sharing.

Most western women are mentally ill…they only want to date dirtbags.

When a normal women is looking for a partner, what goes through her head is "What would he be like to marry?" When a western women is looking for a partner, what goes through her head is "How much does he excite me?"

This results in western women going out with alpha male caricatures with bulging biceps and losers who impregnate them and run off.

Don't believe that you need to change yourself to attract women. Change yourself to make yourself happy and nothing else

The best advice ever. Too many western men lives their whole lives as a perpetual attempt to impress women. When you go to a gym in America and see the men there, they are not spending the hours there to make themselves feel good, they are doing it in an attempt to impress women (and mostly failing).

So you earn good money? Are you able to do it online? If so, the GET OUT OF AMERICA, and see more of the world.

[NorthAmericanguy]

Let me tell you a little about myself before I get into this.
I am a 20 something male, average body, pretty face, and taller then average.
I used to have absolutely no problem finding women to have sex with or go on dates with. Between 17 and 22 I had sex with or dated 12 or so women. I was in "committed" relationships with them as I've always wanted to be a "good" guy.

I was engaged for 3 years and it was the biggest mistake of my life. From 17 to 22 I was a mess. I was pretty much always drunk or messed up in some way. Really low self esteem, constantly suicidal or depressed. I used to smoke a pack of cigarettes a day and wash it down with a bottle of rum almost every night.

What did I notice during this time?
I was constantly getting laid. Sometimes I would get drunk and text old girlfriends to come and buy me cigarettes and drink with me. They'd not only come over but they'd spend money out of their own pockets for the cigarettes! I treated them like dirt or errand girls and they were fine with it.

What changed?
I became a free thinker and a better person. I stopped drinking and smoking as much. I started to treat other people with respect because I finally respected myself.
Today I make really great wages and could live almost any life I'd want.

But what changed along with that?
I'm a nice guy now. Girls aren't attracted to me anymore. Before I used to get on dating sites and it was like shooting fish in a barrel. I wasn't very picky and it always worked out! Now I'm a cleaned up person with plenty of self esteem and women aren't interested. They'd prefer someone they can boss around who hates themselves.

Do not read the "GO FROM NERD TO HUNK!" posts. Women don't give a shit about any of that. I am attractive to women, with decent money. But once you have improved yourself you with expect a higher quality of women and it just won't be there. They will still expect you to pay for everything, listen to them be bitches, and be jealous about every little thing.

Don't believe that you need to change yourself to attract women. Change yourself to make yourself happy and nothing else. Women aren't worth any extra work. They should be here to support you when you need help after working 54 hours. Not the other way around.

I've come to the conclusion that with high self esteem and not wanting to put up with BS there is no women in America for me. They don't care how successful or attractive you are, they will still expect to be treated better then equal.

This is an excellent post, and it reminds me of a woman who I was dating just recently. The woman took pride in the fact that she was college educated, a homeowner, and that she had a great career making good money. This woman is in her 30's and her public image is that she's some kind of upper class sophisticated woman.

Ok, I took a chance on her being that she's an American girl, but quickly found out that it's all fake! The woman in her private life is a drunk, she don't workout, she watches endless amounts of mindless TV, and has a piss poor diet mostly consisting of fast food.

Story short, the woman almost seemed bothered by the fact that I took pride in staying in shape and that I took the time to read books and educate myself outside of work. The woman also flat out said that she was disappointed because I didn't drink.

I saw pictures of her XBF (a man she's still madly in love with), and just going by looks alone, the guy was the opposite of me. Some out of shape guy with no class who drank just as much as her.... I also read stuff between her and her XbF on her FB page from months back and they were talking about how they both had so much fun getting wasted.

At the end of the day women are LAZY and they just want to have FUN. Reading books, working out, eating healthy, ect, ect, is all work to women, so they don't do it unless they're forced to, or they just really happen to believe in that type of lifestyle.

[NorthAmericanguy]

Sometimes the best self-improvement step you can take is to leave.

+1

[jtest28]

I wonder if this is just a white woman/western woman thing? I say that because Ukrainian women are like this now too. How about Filipino women? So far it seems they aren't as bad, but they do still seem to have at least a bit of hatred for men who like them too much.

[Rocky Top]

I've come to the conclusion that with high self esteem and not wanting to put up with BS there is no women in America for me.

You figured it all out faster than I did, it took me about 36 yrs. As long as you stay away from American women your success is guaranteed.

Yeah, I was 35-36 before I gave up on American women.

[Voice of Reason]

I've come to the conclusion that with high self esteem and not wanting to put up with BS there is no women in America for me.

You figured it all out faster than I did, it took me about 36 yrs. As long as you stay away from American women your success is guaranteed.

Yeah, I was 35-36 before I gave up on American women.

I gave up when I was 28. That makes me feel a little bit better

I still wish I had of found this site when I was 20, though. My life would have been much different.

But it's good to see other men realize that American women are just not right for them at such young ages.

[Maverick]

I wonder if this is just a white woman/western woman thing? I say that because Ukrainian women are like this now too. How about Filipino women? So far it seems they aren't as bad, but they do still seem to have at least a bit of hatred for men who like them too much.

Well, I could certainly tell you that Asian women in the US are like this.

Case in point, I was dating an Asian girl about a month ago and was a bit overly nice (I apologized after being too aggressive). She ditched me soon after.

In contrast, I started talking to another Asian girl from Seattle online and was a dick to her the entire time. I told her about how much of a player I was, didn't respond to her texts, and turned every conversation into a sexual one. She is now flying down here on her own dime to hang out with me and have sex all weekend.

It's actually disappointing how well this works.

One of my great fears is that the MGTOW guys are right and.....AWALT all over the world.

And, to the OP, my story mirrors yours (sans the engagement). The only difference was that, despite overwhelming evidence, I still held out for a decent girl in the US. I think I've finally realized and internalized the fact that that is a myth.

[bladed11]

I woke up at about 25 when I dated this girl who clearly was less attractive than me and not by a little but by quite a margin. I could have done a lot better if women were normal human beings. Turned out she too was just another spoiled stupid bitch. I thought maybe I should lower my standards a bit but it made no difference. They are all impossible. There comes that time in life when you get that ahah moment. It isn't me. It's bitches. I call them bitches because hey female dogs are exactly what they are.