MGTOW is BS !

[Winston]

I'm doing a podcast interview today with the mgtow group. I'll post the link to it when it's uploaded. Here's the link to listen live at 7pm PST:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6ap9XPfrrVY

[Winston]

Did anyone listen to it? It was a panel discussion via video chat on Google Hangouts. It should be posted now on YouTube at this link:

[newlifeinphilippines]

MGTOW is the future not happier abroad. Why pander to foreign women and wind up with even worse results. A true man will be a slave to Jesus not women (no matter where). that is true enlightenment.

[Cornfed]

MGTOW is the future not happier abroad.

Except it can't be the future because any society where this occurs to any great extent will die out or be wiped out.

[newlifeinphilippines]

MGTOW is the future not happier abroad.

Except it can't be the future because any society where this occurs to any great extent will die out or be wiped out.

MGTOW and happier abroad are both niche markets. So it never will become mainstream. I think MGTOW will be more popular if you include TFL apart of MGTOW as a subgroup. Most people can't find it practical or have the courage to go abroad. And MGTOW makes sense in alot of levels anyways especially as ones sex drive decreases (or spirituality increases) with age. I can probably be either group (MGTOW or happier abroad) but at this time happier abroad isn't making sense cause there is too many complications and risks and i have other focuses.

[Winston]

Did any of you listen to the podcast? Those guys claimed that they could pick up women in America and get laid. One guy even said that in Las Vegas, he picked up 5 girls in one night. lol. They also asked me if I took the confidence I gained in Russia and tried approaching girls in the US with it. I said yes I did, and the result was that they got creeped out and some called security to report me for harassment, and one woman even called the police. When the officer came, I explained what happened and he AGREED with me that the woman called the police frivolously without basis, and then he left. But before he did, he told me that his friend was having trouble finding any dates in America too. Then when I said that 99.99 percent of guys do not cold approach girls, one guy said that all the guys he knew approached girls. lol

One of you guys should go on the podcast with them and give your side of the story too.

If anyone wants to be a guest on their podcast, go to their Facebook group, join up and then post your request to be a guest. Here's the link to their group: https://www.facebook.com/groups/PASDMGTOW/

[MrMan]

they just give up their sexual life and condemned themselves to become sexless angry old farts,

How about using SAOF as an acronym instead of MGTOW then?

they can't even believe in the existance of places like Pattaya or whatever and they utterly disdain prostitution without ever having f***ed a single p4p girl.

I have disdain for it, too. For one thing, going to a prostitute is a pitiful thing to do. It's bad for the run-a-ways who get sucked into this life, sleeping with 10 guys a day to barely eek out a living and pay their pimp so they don't get beat up, or whatever their situation is. And it's gross, to sleep with some woman right after 9 other guys had her with all their sweat and biological material. It's gross and unhealthy.

I've watched a few MGTOW videos on YouTube and their conclusions aren't logical. If states in the US have laws that discriminate against men when it comes to marriage and women like to divorce in the US, what about the rest of the world? I can understand men who've been divorced who've been through the ringer having this attitude. But I don't get why single men in their 20's would buy into it.

If a man really doesn't want to marry, if he has a low sex drive or lives a life of celibacy to spend his time serving God and others, I can greatly respect that. But it's just sad if a man goes MGTOW because he reads the manosphere, gets bitter against women and he's afraid if he marries, she'll divorce and take half, when he really wants a woman, a sexual relationship, even children. Why aren't these guys trying to figure out how to find one of the good wives, one of the 50% who don't divorce, and the subset of that who make their husbands wives happy? I found my wife overseas, but there are some counter-cultural, atypical girls in the US, too.

[Miller]

I have disdain for it, too. For one thing, going to a prostitute is a pitiful thing to do. It's bad for the run-a-ways who get sucked into this life, sleeping with 10 guys a day to barely eek out a living and pay their pimp so they don't get beat up, or whatever their situation is. And it's gross, to sleep with some woman right after 9 other guys had her with all their sweat and biological material. It's gross and unhealthy.

What you say only applies to a minor subset of prostitutes. Most prostitutes in Thailand and elsewhere in East-Asia aren't selling themselves because they were starving on the streets and happened to get picked up by a violent pimp who forced them into the oldest profession. There are women who have no issues whatsoever with f***ing large numbers of men as long as they get paid well. Those are the ones who become prostitutes. For many prostitutes, having sex with clients is just as much of a chore as cooking dinner. Contrary to what is often said, the vast majority of johns aren't psychopaths.

And the "pimp", if there is one, actually works to protect prostitutes from violent or trouble-causing clients. Any girl could chose to work alone if she wants to take the risk. Although not nearly as well-off as Western prostitutes, East-Asian prostitutes make more than enough money to make a decent living.

And it's gross, to sleep with some woman right after 9 other guys had her with all their sweat and biological material. It's gross and unhealthy.

Plenty of men can only get regular sex with an attractive woman if they pay for it. I don't like prostitution, but it's a useful last-resort option for men who can't get laid in spite of having tried their best.

Why aren't these guys trying to figure out how to find one of the good wives, one of the 50% who don't divorce, and the subset of that who make their husbands wives happy? I found my wife overseas, but there are some counter-cultural, atypical girls in the US, too.

That's a lot easier said than done. It's much easier outside of the US and Western Europe, but still difficult given the global reach of modern culture.

[newlifeinphilippines]

they just give up their sexual life and condemned themselves to become sexless angry old farts,

How about using SAOF as an acronym instead of MGTOW then?

they can't even believe in the existance of places like Pattaya or whatever and they utterly disdain prostitution without ever having f***ed a single p4p girl.

If a man really doesn't want to marry, if he has a low sex drive or lives a life of celibacy to spend his time serving God and others, I can greatly respect that. But it's just sad if a man goes MGTOW because he reads the manosphere, gets bitter against women and he's afraid if he marries, she'll divorce and take half, when he really wants a woman, a sexual relationship, even children. Why aren't these guys trying to figure out how to find one of the good wives, one of the 50% who don't divorce, and the subset of that who make their husbands wives happy? I found my wife overseas, but there are some counter-cultural, atypical girls in the US, too.

Well you didn't exactly do that either. you married an indonesian woman not an american and also you even LIVED there so it required little effort when indonesian women are already chasing foreign men to begin with. I bet you may have wound up on this forum crying about women had you not lived overseas in the first place and had to do once a year vacations overseas to look for one or had to court an american woman.

By the way you shouldnt feel sorry for prostitutes anymore than a mall worker. In fact I feel more sorry for the mall worker or sari sari store. Prostitutes LOVE what they do deep down. They wouldn't do it if hey didn't. Thats a rather feminist viewpoint you have, I had a prostitute girlfriend so I know what they are really like.

[MrMan]

[
Well you didn't exactly do that either. you married an indonesian woman not an american and also you even LIVED there so it required little effort when indonesian women are already chasing foreign men to begin with.

Most Indonesian women weren't out chasing foreign men. I avoided that type. That may have been where I put in more effort, not pursuing women who were interested that I was better off not pursuing. I began to see a woman being too aggressive about showing interest as a bit of a turn off when I was there. I wondered if they were likely to be 'good girls', and I wasn't attracted to most women there anyway.

I bet you may have wound up on this forum crying about women had you not lived overseas in the first place and had to do once a year vacations overseas to look for one or had to court an american woman.

It's hard to say what would have been. I think going overseas for a wife is a really good option for a lot of men. But I think it's unrealistic to say that no American single woman would make a good wife. Nowadays, women in the US who would have meet my criteria-- freakishly beautiful, sincere Christian, not crazy, not overweight, a virgin with no tattoos-- that would be hard to find in the US.

By the way you shouldnt feel sorry for prostitutes anymore than a mall worker. In fact I feel more sorry for the mall worker or sari sari store. Prostitutes LOVE what they do deep down. They wouldn't do it if hey didn't. Thats a rather feminist viewpoint you have, I had a prostitute girlfriend so I know what they are really like.

There may be some prostitutes who love what they do. I suspect more of them love the money than the sex, especially if they get way more than what they want to. They are getting paid to sin for a living. It is a very high risk job, not only for injury, but especially for disease, including STDs that aren't on the top of the list to check for and the ones that condoms don't protect against.

I don't consider my arguments to be 'feminist.' That's kind of silly. Conservative Christians are also against prostitution and pornography. Feminists are against it for different reasons. Whether a prostitute enjoys her work or not, it's a dangerous profession. And we all know there are girls forced into this in mafia type rings around the world. When one of them is rescued by a neighbor, it makes the news here in the US. I don't know what percent of prostitutes are in that situation or got into the situation that way many years ago. I'd imagine the successful ones figure out how to put on a smiling face and a pleasant attitude to make more money whether they like it or not.

[newlifeinphilippines]

[
Well you didn't exactly do that either. you married an indonesian woman not an american and also you even LIVED there so it required little effort when indonesian women are already chasing foreign men to begin with.

Most Indonesian women weren't out chasing foreign men. I avoided that type. That may have been where I put in more effort, not pursuing women who were interested that I was better off not pursuing. I began to see a woman being too aggressive about showing interest as a bit of a turn off when I was there. I wondered if they were likely to be 'good girls', and I wasn't attracted to most women there anyway.

I bet you may have wound up on this forum crying about women had you not lived overseas in the first place and had to do once a year vacations overseas to look for one or had to court an american woman.

It's hard to say what would have been. I think going overseas for a wife is a really good option for a lot of men. But I think it's unrealistic to say that no American single woman would make a good wife. Nowadays, women in the US who would have meet my criteria-- freakishly beautiful, sincere Christian, not crazy, not overweight, a virgin with no tattoos-- that would be hard to find in the US.

By the way you shouldnt feel sorry for prostitutes anymore than a mall worker. In fact I feel more sorry for the mall worker or sari sari store. Prostitutes LOVE what they do deep down. They wouldn't do it if hey didn't. Thats a rather feminist viewpoint you have, I had a prostitute girlfriend so I know what they are really like.

There may be some prostitutes who love what they do. I suspect more of them love the money than the sex, especially if they get way more than what they want to. They are getting paid to sin for a living. It is a very high risk job, not only for injury, but especially for disease, including STDs that aren't on the top of the list to check for and the ones that condoms don't protect against.

I don't consider my arguments to be 'feminist.' That's kind of silly. Conservative Christians are also against prostitution and p***. Feminists are against it for different reasons. Whether a prostitute enjoys her work or not, it's a dangerous profession. And we all know there are girls forced into this in mafia type rings around the world. When one of them is rescued by a neighbor, it makes the news here in the US. I don't know what percent of prostitutes are in that situation or got into the situation that way many years ago. I'd imagine the successful ones figure out how to put on a smiling face and a pleasant attitude to make more money whether they like it or not.

yeah from my experience the one i was with was an exceptional actress in every way. It was mainly for the money even if they acted like you were a God i think it was all a phony act with her. Then again many times it didn't seem like an act. She put on a better act than most "real girls". I think she didn't want to be that of course but at the same time seh definitely enjoyed it to some level compared to the average girl. If a girl doesn't enjoy being a prostitute she never would be one or she would be so miserable doing it that no one would want to be around her and she wouldn't last. Many girls get into prostitution but they quickly get out ca use they are so miserable but the ones who keep at it definitely enjoy it to some extent. So all in all the active ones enjoy it enough for the money.

[Boxman]

Most Indonesian women weren't out chasing foreign men. I avoided that type. That may have been where I put in more effort, not pursuing women who were interested that I was better off not pursuing. I began to see a woman being too aggressive about showing interest as a bit of a turn off when I was there. I wondered if they were likely to be 'good girls', and I wasn't attracted to most women there anyway.

A bit off topic but I'm curious how you ended up marrying an Indonesian girl. What's your nationality and background? Just basically wondering what's your story.

I always like to talk with the guys that are actually living the HA lifestyle (as opposed to just whining and talking about it like most of the people on this forum).

[MrMan]

Most Indonesian women weren't out chasing foreign men. I avoided that type. That may have been where I put in more effort, not pursuing women who were interested that I was better off not pursuing. I began to see a woman being too aggressive about showing interest as a bit of a turn off when I was there. I wondered if they were likely to be 'good girls', and I wasn't attracted to most women there anyway.

A bit off topic but I'm curious how you ended up marrying an Indonesian girl. What's your nationality and background? Just basically wondering what's your story.

I always like to talk with the guys that are actually living the HA lifestyle (as opposed to just whining and talking about it like most of the people on this forum).

I'm American, from the Southeastern US. I went overseas to teach English and ended up taking a job in Indonesia eventually. After just under two years there, I started dating my wife. We figured out we'd been introduced briefly the first year I was there.

I've got a thread on here somewhere about finding a wife in Indonesia that tells a little of my story.

[newlifeinphilippines]

I dont think MGTOW is b.s at all.

I dont have the money now to travel to waste searching for one or live abroad. Even if I did im not sure i could find what i want (my standards are very strict and probably only 1 out of 500 would fit the bill) and since i struggle to get women i doubt ill magically find that 1 out of 500 lol. For me MGTOW allows me to get closer to God in some ways hopefully. I dont see the advantage of finding a foreign wife, most dont like sex that much, most want kids which i dont want anyways, most want you to support their parents and I could care less about their parents when ill be struggling to support myself let alone anyone else, most will divorce you if you bring them back or at least you walk on egg shells to prevent it but either way sounds scary, and who wants to live in a 3rd world country forever when im happy in america and with my own culture and its beauty cause they are scared of divorce. Seems stupid all of it. I think MGTOW is way smarter. Now I know why Mr.s is MGTOW even while living abroad.

[Boxman]

I'm American, from the Southeastern US. I went overseas to teach English and ended up taking a job in Indonesia eventually. After just under two years there, I started dating my wife. We figured out we'd been introduced briefly the first year I was there.

I've got a thread on here somewhere about finding a wife in Indonesia that tells a little of my story.

Where do you live now?

And what are your impressions of life in Indonesia for a white foreigner?

I dont think MGTOW is b.s at all.

I dont have the money now to travel to waste searching for one or live abroad. Even if I did im not sure i could find what i want (my standards are very strict and probably only 1 out of 500 would fit the bill) and since i struggle to get women i doubt ill magically find that 1 out of 500 lol. For me MGTOW allows me to get closer to God in some ways hopefully. I dont see the advantage of finding a foreign wife, most dont like sex that much, most want kids which i dont want anyways, most want you to support their parents and I could care less about their parents when ill be struggling to support myself let alone anyone else, most will divorce you if you bring them back or at least you walk on egg shells to prevent it but either way sounds scary, and who wants to live in a 3rd world country forever when im happy in america and with my own culture and its beauty cause they are scared of divorce. Seems stupid all of it. I think MGTOW is way smarter. Now I know why Mr.s is MGTOW even while living abroad.

Why not join a catholic monastery? Become a monk. I'm not being a smartass; I'm serious. If you want to get closer to "God" that seems like a pure and humble path to follow, and with that lifestyle, celibacy is a requirement not a choice, so that kind of fits in nicely with your MGTOW philosophy.