The Sugar Baby Culture - A Revelation

[Contrarian Expatriate]

This new book is coming out soon on Amazon. I can't wait to read it. Sugar Babying is a great lifestyle for established men who don't want to marry and enjoy fresh supplies of young women.

[WorldTraveler]

No, I'm saying it's close to prostitution, if not outright prostitution, because it's paying a woman to have sex.

Outright paying a young woman to date you is kind of pitiful. You have a very bizaar world view from my perspective, to defend paying a girl to go out with you and have sex with you, and then look down on people who get married.

If it's about money, I can only say, after being married for 40 years, as man - husband and father - you pay always for your women - (like myself with wife and daughters and granddaughter and fostergirl) - regardless if you are married or not. Openly said, from a financial point of view I see no difference.

About prostitution, the question is what is wrong with prostitution? About marriage, what is wrong with marriage?
And what is wrong with a life-style somewhat between prostitution and marriage?

I also wonder if prostitution or 'something close to it' is not considerably cheaper and less risky than being married and taking care of a family.

What is left over are merely aspects of moral consideration, resulting in complaints from feminists and clergymen and some other rather useless and non-productive people...

Yohan, great reply from a man with wisdom. I'm sick of these jealous assholes. These are typically married men or men too afraid to go travel. I have a friend who says all women overseas are just a bunch of gold diggers and whores. He's been married and divorced twice. Unfortunately there are many jealous men in the West. The West and its competitive and feminist culture breeds these jealous assholes!

[WorldTraveler]

No, I'm saying it's close to prostitution, if not outright prostitution, because it's paying a woman to have sex.

Outright paying a young woman to date you is kind of pitiful. You have a very bizaar world view from my perspective, to defend paying a girl to go out with you and have sex with you, and then look down on people who get married.

If it's about money, I can only say, after being married for 40 years, as man - husband and father - you pay always for your women - (like myself with wife and daughters and granddaughter and fostergirl) - regardless if you are married or not. Openly said, from a financial point of view I see no difference.

About prostitution, the question is what is wrong with prostitution? About marriage, what is wrong with marriage?
And what is wrong with a life-style somewhat between prostitution and marriage?

I also wonder if prostitution or 'something close to it' is not considerably cheaper and less risky than being married and taking care of a family.

What is left over are merely aspects of moral consideration, resulting in complaints from feminists and clergymen and some other rather useless and non-productive people...

Yohan, great reply from a man with wisdom. I'm sick of these jealous assholes. These are typically married men or men too afraid to go travel. I have a friend who says all women overseas are just a bunch of gold diggers and whores. He's been married and divorced twice. Unfortunately there are many jealous men in the West. The West and its competitive and feminist culture breeds these jealous assholes!

[Contrarian Expatriate]

9 Things You're Probably Getting Wrong About Sugar Babies

https://www.thisisinsider.com/sugar-baby-myths-2018-3

[Contrarian Expatriate]

For the skeptics and those who understand nothing about true female nature, watch this Hungarian man turn this sweet girl into his sugar baby. She warned him that she has a serious boyfriend, but she does not yet realize that she has two boyfriends now.



American girls are even easier. They don't give the passive resistance that this young girl gave at first.

By the way, he gave her about the Hungarian equivalent of 140 US Dollars.

I do think he is a douche by recording her without her knowledge and posting the video online, but I have seen worse things done to men by unscrupulous women.

His strategy is a bit more bold andrandom than mine. I like to get to know the girl a bit before introducing the element of money into it. But I can attest, this is the best way to get a bevy of young, HOT girls to do whatever you like.

Now you know a little more about true female nature, compare this to multi-billionaire Robert Kraft who was recently busted in a massage parlor with ugly, dirty, trafficked Asian prostitutes. It is save to say that he knows nothing about true female nature!

You can thank me later........

[NMBob]

There are tons of staged videos on youtube, and this video is about as real as a unicorn. Not that (edit) there aren't sugar babies etc, but this has 80% + chance of being a staged and scripted video.

[Contrarian Expatriate]

There are tons of staged videos on youtube, and this video is about as real as a unicorn. Not that they aren't sugar babies etc, but this has 80% + chance of being a staged and scripted video.

This phenomenon will always appear “staged” to someone who has never experienced it and can’t even conceive that women are often this way. So your skepticism is very much understood.

[Contrarian Expatriate]

The female rationalization hamster spins into overdrive when money is dangled in front of them. This is what Sugar Babying is all about as well as this related phenomonon. Not all women agree, but if you establish enough rapport with them, they almost always do in my experience. Once they do, they are always available at your beck and call for more of your "mutual secret."

[Contrarian Expatriate]

Well NO SHIAT Lacey! Some of us have known this for decades already, as much society tries to keep it taboo in an effort to preserve the veneer of female virtue.

It is just blue pill simps, tradcucks, and incels who can't get their heads around it.

[Kamdodo]

Why, thankya.


Snem
who, for whatever reason, half expected that this thread would die a quick death shrugs...

You are quite welcome. Hmmm...still looks alive. See? Great idea

Tim

[have2fly]

I can almost see the appeal of a sugar baby, but I also realize that it is basically a cheat around the system.

CE, you are definitely a smart guy. I enjoy reading your posts. But you realize that you are actually adding to the problem by running over-the-system (essentially bribing your way to get girls)? I see tons of girls actually posting their Venmo wallets right on Tinder, Bumble and other dating apps. There are so many of them it is already mainstream. You are adding to this. Men like you are creating a lazy online subdivision of women that leech off any men they find. I see direct correlation with prostitution. Would I be a sugar daddy? Absolutely. It is a cheaper and easier way to get young girls in the U.S. without wasting time and money on dating that usually gets you nothing in return. But if you look at this as a social experiment, men encourage women to stay home and look for sugar daddies instead of developing work skills or getting any education. Online dating in the U.S. was always lame, now it is close to impossible to find anything valuable since about 60% of the women are only looking for sugar daddies.

[Cornfed]

But if you look at this as a social experiment, men encourage women to stay home and look for sugar daddies instead of developing work skills or getting any education.

This is clearly good compared to encouraging young women to do what they are doing now. Currently females are a scourge in the corporate world and higher education. Encouraging them to be direct whores (although preferably not to niggers) rather than indirect whores is a good thing.

[Contrarian Expatriate]

I can almost see the appeal of a sugar baby, but I also realize that it is basically a cheat around the system.

CE, you are definitely a smart guy. I enjoy reading your posts. But you realize that you are actually adding to the problem by running over-the-system (essentially bribing your way to get girls)? I see tons of girls actually posting their Venmo wallets right on Tinder, Bumble and other dating apps. There are so many of them it is already mainstream. You are adding to this. Men like you are creating a lazy online subdivision of women that leech off any men they find. I see direct correlation with prostitution. Would I be a sugar daddy? Absolutely. It is a cheaper and easier way to get young girls in the U.S. without wasting time and money on dating that usually gets you nothing in return. But if you look at this as a social experiment, men encourage women to stay home and look for sugar daddies instead of developing work skills or getting any education. Online dating in the U.S. was always lame, now it is close to impossible to find anything valuable since about 60% of the women are only looking for sugar daddies.

Those were very kind words. Thank you.

I think there is a distinction to be made between Sugar Babies and FinDom (AKA CashApp or Venmo girls) which I am very much against.

Unlike sugar babies, the FinDom scene is where incels pay exhorbitant amounts of money for virtual relationships with girls online. Some of these guys pay money without even making contact first, and some guys continuously pay money after contact is established. It is a parasitic and exploitative relationship where the women are taking advantage of lonely, yet pathetic men. The most infamous case is the one of Grant Amato who got incrementally milked out of $200,000 by some Bulgarian girl online. When his family discovered that he was stealing money from them to give to her, he killed them all. He was recently convicted of the murders and faced the death penalty at one point.

Sugar baby relationships are quite different. There is actual real life contact and interaction with the girls who you date no differently than other girls. The cost is but a FRACTION of what FinDom idiots pay because they are chasing the proverbial carrot on a stick. Sugar babies are actually interested in the men they date and they can be quite choosy about the men they go out with. Just because you have money, does not mean one can just start sugar dating. I think of a sugar baby allowance as the "plus factor" that places me head and shoulders above the competition to get the opportunity with high SMV girls. But having good game and giving girls a good time or good sex is the glue that binds her too you. The allowance is also a disincentive for the girl to want to damage or leave the relationship.

Keep in mind that the quality of girls I go out with are "girls next door," college girl types, exclusively. FinDom or webcam girls are stripper, vampy, prostitute types who I have no interest in anyhow.

I commend you on being able to have an open mind about sugar dating. There are hordes of really bitter guys who try to criticize it but that is only because either they don't have the courage to try it, they are married and unable to safely try it, or they simply cannot afford to try it so sour grapes is their response to try to dissuade other men from being very happy doing it when they cannot!

About your opinion that guys like me are creating a lazy online subdivision of women that leech off any men they find, of course I disagree because these women are adults and they simply doing what women are programmed to do which is seek out men with resources. The online aspect just makes it overt instead of covert as in the past. There have been studies that show women's attraction to particular men changes according to what she is told the men's status is. There are YouTube videos on this. If my photo was shown to 50 hot girls between 18 and 22, and they were told I was a Barista at Starbucks. All of them would thumb me down and call me creepy. BUT, if that same photo of me were shown to a different group of 50 hot girls of the same age range, but they were told I was a wealthy, world-traveling, investment finance magnate, a sizable proportion of those girls would be very interested and willing to go out with me. This is just a quirk of female nature.

Western culture wants men to have every disadvantage vis a vis women possible. That's why there is this shaming impulse when men leverage their wealth and status to attract women. Once you ignore that shaming, you are home free!

But a word of caution, this is not for younger guys who should be in the wealth and status accumulation phase of life. I am in my early 50's and believe me when I tell you I date girls from age 18 to 25 ONLY. These are girls I would never have had a chance with when I was in my teens and twenties. Dating experience at that age involves a lot or rejection and seasoning that makes it a breeze when you are older and more successful. So younger guys should not waste money on sugar babies until they have "made it" in their upper 30s or beyond.

[Contrarian Expatriate]

This is Aaron Clarey's current take on sugar babies. He is a former naysayer but has turned the corner as more and more smart men of means are doing.

[Shemp]

I briefly scanned this thread and noticed I didn't participate. I must have been absent from the forum while it was active, otherwise I would have chimed in, since I've been sugar daddying for years now. Because I have an active travel life, it is only occasionally that I'm stationary long enough to seek out a sugar baby, so my actual experience is limited.

Currently I have an escort in Ukraine who I have sort of converted into a sugar baby, though I prefer the term rental girlfriend, since I've been seeing her regularly for past three summers (about 70 meetings of 4 hours each so far) and will be seeing her again this summer. Converting a top-tier escort is an excellent way to get a trouble-free and high-quality rental girlfriend. After a few years, most escorts lose their initial enthusiasm for new men and start focusing on a small group of preferred customers. Advantage of escorts is that you can test drive a whole bunch very quickly, like I did, looking for a good match, then immediately convert her to rental girlfriend by simply seeing her frequently. I am only interested in a summer girlfriend, so monogamy is unrealistic in my case, but if you are in a location full-time, monogamy could be an option, for the right price. Disadvantage of my approach is that top-tier escorts are not cheap. However, given how costs in Ukraine are low, even top level prices there are still affordable for me. I pay $250 for each 4 hour session, or about $6000 for the summer (24 sessions). If I were living full-time in Ukraine, I would probably only see the girl once weekly, so $12000/year. (Price levels in Kyiv,Ukraine about 1/3 that of Dallas, TX, USA, so comparable price would be $750 for 4 hours in Dallas.)

Non-escort (aka civilian) girls are much cheaper, but it can be extremely time consuming to find a good one, same as with regular dating. I don't have such time, because of my traveling lifestyle that I mentioned above. Back when I was more stationary than now, I used seeking.com (seeking arrangement back then) to find sugar babies in flyover country in the USA. I offered somewhere around $200-$300 for 2-3 hours. Most of the girls who responded where either low class hoodrats or physically unattractive (obesity epidemic, bad skin, etc) or incompatible in personality, so that masturbation seemed preferable. But I did meet 3 high-quality candidates and had relationships of about 2 months with each of these. But they weren't high enough quality for me to be fully enthusiastic, the way I am with that escort in Ukraine, who is truly top-tier. My impression is that seeking.com is now 99% trash but still 1% of quality girls for those willing to put in the hours necessary to find them: searching the site, texting, going on meet and greet dates, putting up with flaking, etc.

An alternative to seeking.com is to simply announce yourself to be a "generous gentlemen seeking mutually beneficial relationship with younger woman" on Tinder. Those are the magic words that say you're a sugar daddy but won't cause you to be immediately banned (I don't think). Be discreet in all communication on Tinder, move to WhatsApp or similar ASAP, continue to be discreet, SCREEN MERCILESSLY FOR SCAMMERS, FLAKES, CLUELESS NEWBIES, LACK.OF MUTUAL CHEMISTRY, ETC. You can't waste time on junk candidates. Unlike with regular dating, a man who is paying a decent amount ($300 for 2 hours on flyover country is plenty decent) is in high demand, so no need to pursue unpromising leads. Just wait and good leads will eventually appear.

You need to work on inner game when paying. A lot of guys are weaklings who think paying is humiliating. On the contrary, paying is empowering, assuming you have money. Compare paying for dinner at a restaurant versus singing and begging for dinner. If the amounts of money I listed above bother you, then you can greatly reduce costs in second-tier cities of Ukraine with civilian girls. Think $400/month for monogamous girlfriend you see as often as you want or maybe live with. If even that is too much or you are forced to live in the USA because of job, then just go MGTOW and masturbate, which is also empowering. Whereas allowing your happiness, including your sexual happiness, to be dependent on women's sexual whims is very disempowering.