How many of you are actually Mgtow?

[Contrarian Expatriate]

CE, I didn't read all your post because you are just trying to throw insults, trying to drag me into an argument.

If you can't tell the difference between legitimate criticism and personal insults, then I would agree that you should not read anything that I wrote. Other readers can certainly benefit from it.

As i said to you from before i am done arguing with you.

That is probably a wise decision. Coming to terms with all of your incorrect assumptions about life and women is not for those who are poorly equipped to deal with the cognitive dissonance. Hopefully, you'll learn the hard way....

[Splicelo]

CE, I didn't read all your post because you are just trying to throw insults, trying to drag me into an argument.

If you can't tell the difference between legitimate criticism and personal insults, then I would agree that you should not read anything that I wrote. Other readers can certainly benefit from it.

As i said to you from before i am done arguing with you.

That is probably a wise decision. Coming to terms with all of your incorrect assumptions about life and women is not for those who are poorly equipped to deal with the cognitive dissonance. Hopefully, you'll learn the hard way....

You seem to not be understanding, i don't mind having civil disagreement with you, but you can't seem to do so continually without trying to throw insults. So that's the kind of argument i see getting dragged into again as a waste of time. In your previous response you was just responding to me without the unecessary rudeness, but in the response after that, you are super defesive and you are trying to start a flame war.

[Yohan]

Splicelo wrote:
So what about men who are married and claim to be mgtow?
So long as these very few men understand the truths about female nature and how they can leverage state power against men, who am I to say they are not MGTOW? I can say Yohan is the only person I would put in that catagory.

Also, Yohan is married too, but unlike Coach Red Pill, he does not go around mischaracterizing MGTOW to make his lifestyle choices look preferable.

So long as these very few men understand the truths about female nature and how they can leverage state power against men, who am I to say they are not MGTOW? I can say Yohan is the only person I would put in that catagory.

Thanks for your comment, Contrarian Expatriate.

Let me say there is a big difference between men like myself who relocated and married a foreign woman BEFORE the existence of the internet and regular use of the term MGTOW - or Western young men who have now access to much better information than I had more than 40 years ago.

I joined MGTOW around 2004, but I relocated to Asia around 1973, I am married since 1976/never had a divorce.
What was not possible in Western countries - not even one time, not even for 30 minutes - was easily possible in Asia.
I never came back to Europe - even not for a short visit.

I give the advice as MGTOW to any Western man not even willing to try it with the Western feminist trash girl next door. Ignore them.

Many outsiders - like Splicelo - believe in feminist propaganda that MGTOW are broken men who could not find any girlfriend and therefore hate all women.

But this is totally wrong - I do not hate anybody. I often said, you have to overcome 'hate' as it is self-destructive.

I became interested into relocation and foreign women, because I was badly treated by females (and some men too) next to me in Europe who had no sexual relationship with me.... mother, half-sisters, female relatives, people related to the Catholic Church of both gender, female teachers, female co-workers...I never made it up to any sexual relationship with a Western woman.

-----

Sometimes, when I meet some Western men they ask me if I would do it again, or if I regret to settle down in Asia, married with children, fosterdaughter, grandchildren who are all so different from me by their life-style, language, religion etc. - I can only answer, I have no problem so far - everything is OK with my Asian family members.

However if I do it again? ... I think likely I will NOT do it again - the situation changed so much, it became much worse for men... 1972 is not 2019...
Very big difference - also here in Asia.

[Splicelo]

Splicelo wrote:
So what about men who are married and claim to be mgtow?
So long as these very few men understand the truths about female nature and how they can leverage state power against men, who am I to say they are not MGTOW? I can say Yohan is the only person I would put in that catagory.

Also, Yohan is married too, but unlike Coach Red Pill, he does not go around mischaracterizing MGTOW to make his lifestyle choices look preferable.

So long as these very few men understand the truths about female nature and how they can leverage state power against men, who am I to say they are not MGTOW? I can say Yohan is the only person I would put in that catagory.

Thanks for your comment, Contrarian Expatriate.

Let me say there is a big difference between men like myself who relocated and married a foreign woman BEFORE the existence of the internet and regular use of the term MGTOW - or Western young men who have now access to much better information than I had more than 40 years ago.

I joined MGTOW around 2004, but I relocated to Asia around 1973, I am married since 1976/never had a divorce.
What was not possible in Western countries - not even one time, not even for 30 minutes - was easily possible in Asia.
I never came back to Europe - even not for a short visit.

I give the advice as MGTOW to any Western man not even willing to try it with the Western feminist trash girl next door. Ignore them.

Many outsiders - like Splicelo - believe in feminist propaganda that MGTOW are broken men who could not find any girlfriend and therefore hate all women.

But this is totally wrong - I do not hate anybody. I often said, you have to overcome 'hate' as it is self-destructive.

I became interested into relocation and foreign women, because I was badly treated by females (and some men too) next to me in Europe who had no sexual relationship with me.... mother, half-sisters, female relatives, people related to the Catholic Church of both gender, female teachers, female co-workers...I never made it up to any sexual relationship with a Western woman.

-----

Sometimes, when I meet some Western men they ask me if I would do it again, or if I regret to settle down in Asia, married with children, fosterdaughter, grandchildren who are all so different from me by their life-style, language, religion etc. - I can only answer, I have no problem so far - everything is OK with my Asian family members.

However if I do it again? ... I think likely I will NOT do it again - the situation changed so much, it became much worse for men... 1972 is not 2019...
Very big difference e in Asia.

Yohan i don't think every single last mgtow hate all women, but there is a big community of mgtow which do hate women. Just like there is big community of feminist who are men haters. For example i don't think CE hates women.

How i came to my conclusion that some mgtow men do hate women is by listening to self proclaimed mgtow themself. I don't listen to feminist much at all, so i've never even heard a feminist opinion about mgtow, so i really don't know where you got that idea. I can however see where some mgtow men are coming from and they make lots of sense due to the western system being rigged against men, but there are a huge portion of mgtow which are anti women and do have the mentality same as feminist to hate the opposite gender.

Also i don't think all mgtow men can't get a girlfriend. And i never said that. You really like to put words in my mouth. There are some mgtow men who are quite logical but there are many more who are filled with hate. The mgtow movement is quite largely dysfunctional like feminism.

And just as i said before mgtow men keep coming up with their own definition of what mgtow is. CE says mgtow is anti marriage, but then make an exception for marriage if he is near the end of his life. And every other man who chooses to marry while still young is a slave according to him. He calls all married men slaves to their wife, ALL of them. All except YOU of course. You both are contradicting each other as to what mgtow is. But yet cosigning each other's contradictions.
It's law everyone has to drive on the right hand side of the road all except you logic.


I am actually subscribed to some of more rational mgtow youtubers and cosign with a lot of what they are saying as they teach men how to be red pill aware, instead of focusing on how much of a victim they are or how miserable they are. So i can understand where some of them are coming from. But then i scroll down i read the comments and see how vile some of the mgtow men are towards women. There are also youtubers who push this woman hating propaganda. Sure you will say those men who say vile things are not mgtow, but you also said mgtow are a variety of different type of men, some of those variety happens to hate women.


This whole anti marriage, not wanting to have a family and children, marriage is slavery ideas wont sustain society long term. Mgtow are here because people have relationships, cohabitate, get married. So say every man on earth adopt the same branch of mgtow which CE is, society would literally crash.

[IraqVet2003]

MGTOW is a lifestyle, not a political ideology or movement so you are foolishly comparing apples to bananas.

Also, MGTOW don't recruit or convince people. Men FIND and gravitate towards MGTOW because it is honest about female nature and the societal forces (Courts, media, law, police, etc) working against men in favor of women.

MGTOW don't need you to be convinced of anything. You can go on a believe what you want about it. Continue to compare it to feminism all you wish. MGTOW don't care about men like yourself who do nothing but complain and rant about things you don't have a clue about.

www.MGTOW.com has plenty of material to get you starting in understanding MGTOW. You don't need to come on a non-MGTOW forum and start flame wars about what MGTOW is and what it is not. Go find out for yourself like intelligent people do.

And again, MGTOW does not need you nor your agreement with any of its core principles. It is growing fine enough with out you and will continue to do so....

Hey Contrarian Expatriate, here is another video related to the topic of MGTOW I think you would really like and it's by Donovan Sharpe!!!!

WHY ARE SO MANY BLACK MEN GOING #MGTOW?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SlpRjqVEdZ8

[Contrarian Expatriate]

MGTOW is a lifestyle, not a political ideology or movement so you are foolishly comparing apples to bananas.

Also, MGTOW don't recruit or convince people. Men FIND and gravitate towards MGTOW because it is honest about female nature and the societal forces (Courts, media, law, police, etc) working against men in favor of women.

MGTOW don't need you to be convinced of anything. You can go on a believe what you want about it. Continue to compare it to feminism all you wish. MGTOW don't care about men like yourself who do nothing but complain and rant about things you don't have a clue about.

www.MGTOW.com has plenty of material to get you starting in understanding MGTOW. You don't need to come on a non-MGTOW forum and start flame wars about what MGTOW is and what it is not. Go find out for yourself like intelligent people do.

And again, MGTOW does not need you nor your agreement with any of its core principles. It is growing fine enough with out you and will continue to do so....

Hey Contrarian Expatriate, here is another video related to the topic of MGTOW I think you would really like and it's by Donovan Sharpe!!!!

WHY ARE SO MANY BLACK MEN GOING #MGTOW?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SlpRjqVEdZ8

Yes, I viewed that when it first came out. I have been a viewer of Donovan's work for several years now.

About black men and MGTOW, it has been said by many that black American men are the first population of American men to go MGTOW en masse. In a sense that is correct, but like most men who have gone their own way, most black men who have done so have no idea about MGTOW as a concept.

[Yohan]

Yohan
How i came to my conclusion that some mgtow men do hate women is by listening to self proclaimed....

Your own word 'self-proclaimed' says it all - These are loners, often located in USA, who are operating a blog alone - maybe better check out MGTOW related forums and read members comments.

If you read back for example 1000s of my comments and those which members made in the MGTOW-forum I am active, you will notice that newcomers who signing up with hateful comments are clearly discouraged to continue to think in this way.

Keep always in your mind that men are not born as MGTOW and are not hateful against ALL women. Men who are hating ALL women had a serious reason/any life-changing experience in their past.

We tell these newcomers who were badly treated by women (often related to divorce/children/cheating/violence from women/ biased court decisions - but also by mothers, sisters, female relatives etc) that HATE is self destructive, harming only yourself and a painful way leading to nowhere - making your problems even worse. Such men have to learn about how to deal with that, how to remove HATE from their mindset.

So how can this done? It is not easy for MGTOW to convince newcomers, as many men are acting stupidly and do not want to listen...

I and some other MGTOWs with me advice men since many many years to remove their hate against ALL women by transforming it into rejecting and ignoring only CERTAIN women - women who are treating you badly.

Next step is be active and get away from your past - get away from the location where bad things happened to you and start a new life with entire new people around you. USA is a large place, just move away and freeze any contact with these women and their relatives and their friends, forget about them. Your hate will disappear - slowly but it will disappear....

If possible, relocate to overseas, there are 100.000s of men who did that....remove your religious bias, remove any racist feelings, accept people who speak different languages etc... - try to accept women who are totally different from the women you know. Forget about the idea that 'a real man should know how to treat a real woman' and similar feminist BS - you yourself are the priority in your mindset...

I don't listen to feminist much at all, so i've never even heard a feminist opinion about mgtow

You should do that - you will notice soon differences between MGTOW and feminism.

The mgtow movement is quite largely dysfunctional like feminism.

I disagree. If MGTOW is so dysfunctional as you claim, I wonder why feminists are now so afraid of it. Even afraid of a movie about 'men's rights' - so afraid they want to ban it. You need only google 'Cassie Jaye'.
It was not always like that - for feminists MGTOW was the laughing stock about 20 years ago when it started... but now not any more.

... men keep coming up with their own definition of what mgtow is. CE says mgtow is anti marriage, but then make an exception for marriage if he is near the end of his life. And every other man who chooses to marry while still young is a slave according to him. He calls all married men slaves to their wife, ALL of them. All except YOU of course. You both are contradicting each other as to what mgtow is. But yet cosigning each other's contradictions.

You mention with your comment a HUGE difference between feminism and MGTOW.
In feminism there is no way to show up with different opinions, either you are with it or you are gone.
Check out what happened to prominent feminist-friendly men and even to women, who dared to disagree with feminists....
Check out a 'Warren Farrell' or an 'Erin Pizzey'....

MGTOW can accept different mindsets - You mention CE Contrarian Expatriate and me - what do we have in common? He is rich, black and single. I am white, married and have an average income, our age and place from where we are coming is different, he is younger than me and from USA and I am from Europe, his native language is different from my one - and still we can understand each other, never had any personal disputes during many years when we write our comments even in the same threads....

[Splicelo]

Yohan
How i came to my conclusion that some mgtow men do hate women is by listening to self proclaimed....

Your own word 'self-proclaimed' says it all - These are loners, often located in USA, who are operating a blog alone - maybe better check out MGTOW related forums and read members comments.

If you read back for example 1000s of my comments and those which members made in the MGTOW-forum I am active, you will notice that newcomers who signing up with hateful comments are clearly discouraged to continue to think in this way.

Keep always in your mind that men are not born as MGTOW and are not hateful against ALL women. Men who are hating ALL women had a serious reason/any life-changing experience in their past.

We tell these newcomers who were badly treated by women (often related to divorce/children/cheating/violence from women/ biased court decisions - but also by mothers, sisters, female relatives etc) that HATE is self destructive, harming only yourself and a painful way leading to nowhere - making your problems even worse. Such men have to learn about how to deal with that, how to remove HATE from their mindset.

So how can this done? It is not easy for MGTOW to convince newcomers, as many men are acting stupidly and do not want to listen...

I and some other MGTOWs with me advice men since many many years to remove their hate against ALL women by transforming it into rejecting and ignoring only CERTAIN women - women who are treating you badly.

Next step is be active and get away from your past - get away from the location where bad things happened to you and start a new life with entire new people around you. USA is a large place, just move away and freeze any contact with these women and their relatives and their friends, forget about them. Your hate will disappear - slowly but it will disappear....

If possible, relocate to overseas, there are 100.000s of men who did that....remove your religious bias, remove any racist feelings, accept people who speak different languages etc... - try to accept women who are totally different from the women you know. Forget about the idea that 'a real man should know how to treat a real woman' and similar feminist BS - you yourself are the priority in your mindset...

I don't listen to feminist much at all, so i've never even heard a feminist opinion about mgtow

You should do that - you will notice soon differences between MGTOW and feminism.

The mgtow movement is quite largely dysfunctional like feminism.

I disagree. If MGTOW is so dysfunctional as you claim, I wonder why feminists are now so afraid of it. Even afraid of a movie about 'men's rights' - so afraid they want to ban it. You need only google 'Cassie Jaye'.
It was not always like that - for feminists MGTOW was the laughing stock about 20 years ago when it started... but now not any more.

... men keep coming up with their own definition of what mgtow is. CE says mgtow is anti marriage, but then make an exception for marriage if he is near the end of his life. And every other man who chooses to marry while still young is a slave according to him. He calls all married men slaves to their wife, ALL of them. All except YOU of course. You both are contradicting each other as to what mgtow is. But yet cosigning each other's contradictions.

You mention with your comment a HUGE difference between feminism and MGTOW.
In feminism there is no way to show up with different opinions, either you are with it or you are gone.
Check out what happened to prominent feminist-friendly men and even to women, who dared to disagree with feminists....
Check out a 'Warren Farrell' or an 'Erin Pizzey'....

MGTOW can accept different mindsets - You mention CE Contrarian Expatriate and me - what do we have in common? He is rich, black and single. I am white, married and have an average income, our age and place from where we are coming is different, he is younger than me and from USA and I am from Europe, his native language is different from my one - and still we can understand each other, never had any personal disputes during many years when we write our comments even in the same threads....

Thank you for your intellectual honesty but most of the men in the world will never be mgtow if it's the branch of mgtow which is anti marriage, anti cohabitation and against having children. Like are you for the extinction of the human race? i think not.

[Yohan]

Thank you for your intellectual honesty but most of the men in the world will never be mgtow.

The Return of Big Red: World's Scariest Feminist!

[Will N. Dowd]

I made a meme about big red, how do I post it here?

[Splicelo]

The Return of Big Red: World's Scariest Feminist!

I use to watch videos to see the feminist mindset a long time back but they are simply too ridiculous for words. That red hair chick is definitely the stereotypical feminist . Annoying and entitled. However i don't believe all western women are like this.

[Splicelo]

This one cracks me up

[Yohan]

Thank you for your intellectual honesty but most of the men in the world will never be mgtow if it's the branch of mgtow which is anti marriage, anti cohabitation and against having children. Like are you for the extinction of the human race?

You have to ask feminists - and not MGTOW - this question.

I am not aware of any MGTOW related publication, which calls for the extinction of the human race or at least for genocide of all females...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SCUM_Manifesto

SCUM Manifesto is a radical feminist manifesto by Valerie Solanas, published in 1967. It argues that men have ruined the world, and that it is up to women to fix it. To achieve this goal, it suggests the formation of SCUM, an organization dedicated to overthrowing society and eliminating the male sex. The Manifesto is widely regarded as satirical, but based on legitimate philosophical and social concerns. It has been reprinted at least 10 times in English, translated into 13 languages, and excerpted several times.

The Manifesto opens with the following declaration:

"Life" in this "society" being, at best, an utter bore and no aspect of "society" being at all relevant to women, there remains to civic-minded, responsible, thrill-seeking females only to overthrow the government, eliminate the money system, institute complete automation and eliminate the male sex.

-----

The SCUM Manifesto has been reprinted at least 10 times in English and translated into Croatian, Czech, Finnish, French, German, Hebrew, Italian, Spanish, Swedish, Turkish, Portuguese, Dutch, and Danish. It has also been excerpted in several feminist anthologies, including Sisterhood is Powerful: An Anthology of Writings From The Women's Liberation Movement (1970), a collection of radical feminist writing edited by Robin Morgan.

Verso Books published an edition in 2004 with an introduction by feminist philosopher Avital Ronell. Jon Purkis and James Bowen describe the SCUM Manifesto as a "pamphlet which has become one of the longest surviving perennials of anarchist publishing".

Solanas's sister, Judith A. Solanas Martinez, is the reported copyright holder of the SCUM Manifesto by 1997 renewal.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Valerie_Solanas

Ti-Grace Atkinson, the New York chapter president of the National Organization for Women (NOW), described Solanas as "the first outstanding champion of women's rights" and "a 'heroine' of the feminist movement"

-----

Another NOW member, Florynce Kennedy, called Solanas "one of the most important spokeswomen of the feminist movement."

[Shemp]

The mgtow movement is quite largely dysfunctional like feminism.

I disagree. If MGTOW is so dysfunctional as you claim, I wonder why feminists are now so afraid of it.

The dysfunctionality of both MGTOW and feminism have nothing to do with what feminists or anyone else thinks, but rather with the effects on child production. A society where rational and disciplined people avoid having children is clearly a long term problem. Right now, Europe and the USA are simply importing young people from the poor countries, to make up for low birth rates among natives, but that may cause other problems eventually.

With widespread MGTOW/feminism and no immigration, then one possibility is most births will be by men and women too stupid to use birth control properly, and we end up with Idiocracy and then everything collapses and society goes back to the stone age. Another possibility is only people with simple-minded conservative views reproduce (like MarcosZeitola) and the next generation will be all simple-minded conservatives and they will change the system to incentivize children and disincentive MGTOW and feminism. In particular, they may eliminate old age pensions for people without children (and probably also people with children who are a burden on society, such as criminals and defectives), eliminate child support so quality men aren't afraid to impregnate extra women, etc.

Japan will eventually take one of these routes, since Japan does not allow much immigration and can't afford pensions for childless people in the long run. Either Idiocracy or a system that incentivizes producing quality children.

[Yohan]

The dysfunctionality of both MGTOW and feminism have nothing to do with what feminists or anyone else thinks, but rather with the effects on child production.

To blame MGTOW for low child production in Western countries - this is ridiculous.

You cannot expect men to do something which often turns out to be harmful for them - Why should men sign up for something which is without any rights but requires financial obligations over decades and is without any incentive and reward in return?

MGTOW is not dysfunctional - it is the normal reaction and response coming from men in return to hateful feminist ideology and actions which is treating men and boys as second class citizens in Western countries.

Why is it 'dysfunctional' if I ask why women are getting away with much more lenient sentences for identical crimes than men?

Why is it 'dysfunctional' if I ask why we spend so much attention to breast cancer, while there is no deep-in research for cystic fibrosis - a fatal lung disease - which is the no. 5 killer of men?

Why is it 'dysfuntional' if I ask why men have to retire later, but die earlier?

.....will change the system to incentivize children and disincentive MGTOW and feminism. In particular, they may eliminate old age pensions for people without children (and probably also people with children who are a burden on society, such as criminals and defectives), eliminate child support so quality men aren't afraid to impregnate extra women, etc.

This is the most strange and funny argument I heard since long time.
Punishing childless men?

Pensions are not a gift from the government, it's a kind of insurance you pay with a fairly large part of your salary over decades for the reason you are financially secured when you are old and cannot work anymore.

-----

About Japan, the reason to be childless for many is not about feminism but economic. - Japan is not hostile against men.

It has more to do with the fact, that Japan is smaller than California, has over 127 million people and only 15 percent of the land can be really used for living. Housing is very expensive and rooms are narrow.

It has also to do with the fact, that in rural areas are living mostly old people with their son who might take over the business of his parents - while younger women all want to live in the large cities where life is more comfortable for them. Often the only solution for such young men in rural areas is to look for a foreign wife.

Here in Japan, we all wish a reduction of the population, which is taking place already now to some extent - there are fewer young people - but old people die first.... nobody living in Japan wants a mass immigration of uneducated foreigners. I share their concern and I am a foreigner in Japan since 4 decades.

I do not want Japan to decline like my native Europe, I like these safe Japanese cities, I am not fond of no-go zones....